ABout 700cc's displacement. Larger throttle body. Larger intake runners. Higher flowing heads. More air goes into the engine every revolution so that more fuel can be burned.Meanie wrote:What's the difference between the K8 and the ZE?
V6 fuel mileage
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
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93' GS SE, the Black Beast, the former love of my life...soon to be gutted and crushed.
94' GS, black on black, now in several small pieces...and one large crushed piece.
2007 Mazda3 GT Sport --- super fun
2004 Honda RC51 --- Lost forever to some theavin' bastard
My Worklog
My feedback thread
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
- MrMazda92
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
I laughed HARD at both of your answers, I think he meant purely from a fuel economy standpoint
Expect to use 10-15% more fuel with the ZE than with the K8, if you drive like a sane human being
Expect to use 10-15% more fuel with the ZE than with the K8, if you drive like a sane human being
Daily:
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
- Ryan
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
Not necessarily. Its not just about displacement, its about efficiency.
The throttle regulates the actual displacement. Sure, the cylinders hold 2.5L at WOT, in certain RPM bands (called the power band), but when you're cruising, your volumetric efficiency might only be 10-15%.
If the K8 needs its VE to be 20% to maintain the same speed, there won't be much if any mileage difference.
Its all about which motor needs less air to do what you're asking it to do. Displacement is just a way to guesstimate which will be better.
But in the real world, I found my KL to only get 50km less per tank (12%) than the K8, and I enjoy shifting from 2nd to 5th.
The throttle regulates the actual displacement. Sure, the cylinders hold 2.5L at WOT, in certain RPM bands (called the power band), but when you're cruising, your volumetric efficiency might only be 10-15%.
If the K8 needs its VE to be 20% to maintain the same speed, there won't be much if any mileage difference.
Its all about which motor needs less air to do what you're asking it to do. Displacement is just a way to guesstimate which will be better.
But in the real world, I found my KL to only get 50km less per tank (12%) than the K8, and I enjoy shifting from 2nd to 5th.
Now with Moderator power!
Black '93 BP RS - wrecked, parted, scrapped.
Green GS - Sold.
Black GS - Summer DD/Race car - Fancy KLZE
Red GS - K8-ATX -> MTX-KLDE - Frakencar. Scrapped
White GS - Rusty. Parts. Scrapped
1997 BMW M3 - my summer baby
2002 BMW 325Xi - sold
2003 Forester Xti - EJ20K swapped.
Feedback
Black '93 BP RS - wrecked, parted, scrapped.
Green GS - Sold.
Black GS - Summer DD/Race car - Fancy KLZE
Red GS - K8-ATX -> MTX-KLDE - Frakencar. Scrapped
White GS - Rusty. Parts. Scrapped
1997 BMW M3 - my summer baby
2002 BMW 325Xi - sold
2003 Forester Xti - EJ20K swapped.
Feedback
- MrMazda92
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
God it feels good to be right
Daily:
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
- _-Night-Shade-_
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
Averaging 26mpg on my KLZE with freed up power and some weight reduction, but also fat, sticky tires. With my K8 it was 30mpg.
- Nd4SpdSe
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
Historically speaking, guys with ZE swaps got better than their K8's, hitting 500-600km on a tank easilly. Doesn't seem to be so much of the case anymore. In one MPG thread (or probably reposted that info over the years) I did a trip from Ottawa back to Niagara, driving hard, hitting over 200km/h regularly, did the trip in 4 and a half hours and still got 31mpg.
Deimos put MANY mines on his Mx-3, I think he was just short of 500'000kms on it because of his job (he has the cluster as a keepsake), and he used to get 600km on a tank regularly, highway of course.
Deimos put MANY mines on his Mx-3, I think he was just short of 500'000kms on it because of his job (he has the cluster as a keepsake), and he used to get 600km on a tank regularly, highway of course.
1992 Mazda Mx-3 GSR - 2.5L KLZE : Award Winning Show Car & Race Car ['02-'09] (Retired)
2004 Mazda RX-8 GT - Renesis Wankel : LS3 Coils, BHR Mid-Pipe + Falken RT-615K 245/40r18
2011 Mazda Mazda2 GS - 1.5L Manual : Yozora Edition (1 of 500)
2003 Nissan Xterra SE - 4x4 Supercharged : 2" Body Lift, 4" Suspension Lift & 33" MTR Kevlar
2001 Nissan Frontier SE - The Frontrailer : Expedition/Off-Road Trailer Project
2004 Mazda RX-8 GT - Renesis Wankel : LS3 Coils, BHR Mid-Pipe + Falken RT-615K 245/40r18
2011 Mazda Mazda2 GS - 1.5L Manual : Yozora Edition (1 of 500)
2003 Nissan Xterra SE - 4x4 Supercharged : 2" Body Lift, 4" Suspension Lift & 33" MTR Kevlar
2001 Nissan Frontier SE - The Frontrailer : Expedition/Off-Road Trailer Project
- mitmaks
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
You should also realize that most people run regular on their K8 vs premium on KLZE
Try putting running premium on K8 I bet your mileage will increase
Try putting running premium on K8 I bet your mileage will increase
Magnum s/s lines, strut bars, carbon fiber bezel, indiglow gauge, Sony Xplod, inverted c/f hood, SRD lower tie bar '93 GS SE '95 Cobra SVT #2722 '68 Charger R/T 440
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
Actually, there hasn't been any statistical evidence to prove premium fuel increases mpg. It simply has higher octane and additives to help with pre-detonation. For a car rated for regular gas, premium fuel will get you worse mileage.mitmaks wrote:You should also realize that most people run regular on their K8 vs premium on KLZE
Try putting running premium on K8 I bet your mileage will increase
- mitmaks
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
I will have to check that out myself to prove this theory correct or incorrect.Meanie wrote:Actually, there hasn't been any statistical evidence to prove premium fuel increases mpg. It simply has higher octane and additives to help with pre-detonation. For a car rated for regular gas, premium fuel will get you worse mileage.mitmaks wrote:You should also realize that most people run regular on their K8 vs premium on KLZE
Try putting running premium on K8 I bet your mileage will increase
Magnum s/s lines, strut bars, carbon fiber bezel, indiglow gauge, Sony Xplod, inverted c/f hood, SRD lower tie bar '93 GS SE '95 Cobra SVT #2722 '68 Charger R/T 440
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- Nd4SpdSe
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
Premium fuel allows for a more aggressive tune of the motor and/or higher compression. If the ECU for the motor is smart enough, it will run as as aggressive as possible to the point before it starts to ping. A perfect example is the 3.0L Honda Accord motor that gains 10hp when running high octane fuel.Meanie wrote:Actually, there hasn't been any statistical evidence to prove premium fuel increases mpg. It simply has higher octane and additives to help with pre-detonation. For a car rated for regular gas, premium fuel will get you worse mileage.mitmaks wrote:You should also realize that most people run regular on their K8 vs premium on KLZE
Try putting running premium on K8 I bet your mileage will increase
With higher octane is required when a motor runs a higher compression. Higher compression yeilds more power. the K8 runs a 9.2:1 while the KLZE is 10.0:1. Although you can't set a scientific baseline on required octane vs compression since each type of motor is designed different, you can use these as guidlines:
It's been a long time since I've read it, but this site is a good read:
http://www.daytona-sensors.com/tech_tuning.html
Higher octane itself doesn't yield better milleage, but allows the motor to run, or be designed to run, at a higher efficiency to yield more power, and with that better milleage. If the motor doesn't take advantage of higher octane, you're just burning your money away. If a motor requires high octane and you run a lower grade, the motor will compensate by reducing the timing and you'll lose power and efficiency.
1992 Mazda Mx-3 GSR - 2.5L KLZE : Award Winning Show Car & Race Car ['02-'09] (Retired)
2004 Mazda RX-8 GT - Renesis Wankel : LS3 Coils, BHR Mid-Pipe + Falken RT-615K 245/40r18
2011 Mazda Mazda2 GS - 1.5L Manual : Yozora Edition (1 of 500)
2003 Nissan Xterra SE - 4x4 Supercharged : 2" Body Lift, 4" Suspension Lift & 33" MTR Kevlar
2001 Nissan Frontier SE - The Frontrailer : Expedition/Off-Road Trailer Project
2004 Mazda RX-8 GT - Renesis Wankel : LS3 Coils, BHR Mid-Pipe + Falken RT-615K 245/40r18
2011 Mazda Mazda2 GS - 1.5L Manual : Yozora Edition (1 of 500)
2003 Nissan Xterra SE - 4x4 Supercharged : 2" Body Lift, 4" Suspension Lift & 33" MTR Kevlar
2001 Nissan Frontier SE - The Frontrailer : Expedition/Off-Road Trailer Project
- MrMazda92
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
For what it's worth I still think 9.5:1(KLDE) vs 10:1(KLZE) bumping from 87 to 92 octane is a joke. No matter how I look at it, a 5% increase in static CR shouldn't require a 50 point octane jump. Either the 10:1 ZE should tolerate lower octane fuel, or the 9.5:1 DE should be running higher.
Daily:
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
- Ryan
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
my Ze runs o.k. on regular (85). But I would say it runs better on 91. Everything, start up, idle, and high RPM just sounds and feels better on 91. Milage is about the same.
Now with Moderator power!
Black '93 BP RS - wrecked, parted, scrapped.
Green GS - Sold.
Black GS - Summer DD/Race car - Fancy KLZE
Red GS - K8-ATX -> MTX-KLDE - Frakencar. Scrapped
White GS - Rusty. Parts. Scrapped
1997 BMW M3 - my summer baby
2002 BMW 325Xi - sold
2003 Forester Xti - EJ20K swapped.
Feedback
Black '93 BP RS - wrecked, parted, scrapped.
Green GS - Sold.
Black GS - Summer DD/Race car - Fancy KLZE
Red GS - K8-ATX -> MTX-KLDE - Frakencar. Scrapped
White GS - Rusty. Parts. Scrapped
1997 BMW M3 - my summer baby
2002 BMW 325Xi - sold
2003 Forester Xti - EJ20K swapped.
Feedback
- MrMazda92
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- Joined: October 8th, 2009, 5:35 pm
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
Regular here is 87 octane, and premium is 92
I'm not a fan of "plus" in the slightest, I think it's a joke that they pull from both tanks and hope for the best.
I'm not a fan of "plus" in the slightest, I think it's a joke that they pull from both tanks and hope for the best.
Daily:
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
'12 Challenger R/T + STP - 3.92 w/ LSD, JG Cam, headers, SkipShift delete, Clutch Delay Valve delete, Hurst STS, RAM Clutch Adjuster, StopTech 6 Piston Brakes, Sticky Nittos, 435 WHP
Kid Hauler:
'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP
First Love:
'92 GS 5 spd - Straightneck KL/67mm TB, MegaSquirt/Coilpacks, 5 lugs/Speed6 brakes/FD wheels, wiretuck, coilovers, headers, AEM WB, Borla
Deleted: VAF/Power Steering/Air Conditioning/EGR/ABS/Auto Seatbelts/etc
- Nd4SpdSe
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
The K8 and KLDE are both 9.2:1. The only one that's 9.5 is the last run of KLZE.MrMazda92 wrote:For what it's worth I still think 9.5:1(KLDE) vs 10:1(KLZE) bumping from 87 to 92 octane is a joke. No matter how I look at it, a 5% increase in static CR shouldn't require a 50 point octane jump. Either the 10:1 ZE should tolerate lower octane fuel, or the 9.5:1 DE should be running higher.
Motors can definitely "tolerate" lower octane, that's what knock sensors and computer-controlling timing systems are for, but doesn't mean it'll give it's best performance.
1992 Mazda Mx-3 GSR - 2.5L KLZE : Award Winning Show Car & Race Car ['02-'09] (Retired)
2004 Mazda RX-8 GT - Renesis Wankel : LS3 Coils, BHR Mid-Pipe + Falken RT-615K 245/40r18
2011 Mazda Mazda2 GS - 1.5L Manual : Yozora Edition (1 of 500)
2003 Nissan Xterra SE - 4x4 Supercharged : 2" Body Lift, 4" Suspension Lift & 33" MTR Kevlar
2001 Nissan Frontier SE - The Frontrailer : Expedition/Off-Road Trailer Project
2004 Mazda RX-8 GT - Renesis Wankel : LS3 Coils, BHR Mid-Pipe + Falken RT-615K 245/40r18
2011 Mazda Mazda2 GS - 1.5L Manual : Yozora Edition (1 of 500)
2003 Nissan Xterra SE - 4x4 Supercharged : 2" Body Lift, 4" Suspension Lift & 33" MTR Kevlar
2001 Nissan Frontier SE - The Frontrailer : Expedition/Off-Road Trailer Project
- Hoodzy
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Re: V6 fuel mileage
Higher octane will not give you better gas mileage as stated above.. may even make it worse..
Not to mention at an extra ten cents per liter.. you have to be putting down a very significant increase in fuel efficiency to even make it worth it.
Not to mention at an extra ten cents per liter.. you have to be putting down a very significant increase in fuel efficiency to even make it worth it.
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