[GI] Poly bushings: Making a Comeback in Feb 09'!!!

[rece]

I am interested as well. I think a full set would benefit my car.

[wytbishop]

I really like the idea. I am sure that a "full kit" would really not benifit all that much. I would like to see motor mount inserts (like the 240's) instead of fillin it with the mud in a can. I'd like to see upgrades for bushings that we'd see and feel true benifit. Paying 300.00 (just a guess) for bushings that don't add anything is not something I am looking for. I do like the option of picking an choosing and the way your going to go about the payment options. Keep up the good work. We'll be watching.

Good feedback thanks. I thought about doing motor mounts, but there are AWR which are popular (and only $160 or so for front and rear) and MazdaSpeed mounts are still ($313 for all 4) available from Corksport so I didn't think I'd be able to compete.

As far as the benefits of the "full kit" of bushings...I think it'll depend on a) how you drive your car and b) what you consider benefitial. If you're club racing or Time Attack racing, suspension and handling are at least as important as power. If you're a street guy then the harsher ride might not be worth the improved handling. Being a daily driver, I just want my MX to be tight.

Whatever your needs, I want everyone to get exactly what they want and nothing that they don't.

I'm also going to look into upgraded sway bar end links.

[onlytrueromeo]

I would want mine for a daily driver as well. It might be worth looking into having them available in different durometers like the motor mounts - My stock rubber ones are REALLY worn, so anything would be better than it is now, but I wouldnt want something like 97 durometer bushings - but some people might.

I guess what I want to know is what advantage would certain parts have with a harder durometer than others? Like which parts would make it handle better without affecting the ride to the extreme.

And also, first and foremost in my book (besides the things not being impossible to install for the average joe) is that the bushings be made NOT TO SQUEAK! I would mind going under my car once every 6 months or so to spray some lubricant, but I wouldnt want to do it on a monthly basis if possible. I've heard talk about the energy suspension or other suspension bushings being very loud and not something you would want to drive with.

[wytbishop]

One of the modifications I'm going to try to incorporate is making them greasable. It may not be possible...but I'm going to do my best.

I have already discussed varying durometers with the manufacturer. I'm not sure what the ideal hardnesses to offer would be. A lot of my research is on this topic. I want to get my hands on a new stock bushing to determine it's hardness. A typical all season tire has a hradness of A70 and thats roughly where I think the stock bushings are too. A100 is the material they make bowling balls out of...very hard. So from A70 - A100 is a pretty dramatic difference. I know that SuperPro offers 80 and 90 and that seems about right. Shore A80 will be noticeably stiffer than stock, but still plyable. Shore A90 will be very stiff, but not bowling ball stiff.

I'm also working on colors. What color bushings would you like to see?

[wytbishop]

OH, and if I win the $46million lottery tonight I promise free bushings for everyone.

[fowljesse]

Do you know, or can you make an educated guess about longevityin relation to hardness? I know that harder Poly wheels last longer, but that's due to wear, not stress. If harder lasts longer, it's another reason to justify cost, while enjoying Kick a$s cornering.
I have everything replaced with stiffer stuff, and I love it! My car handles about the same with stock tires, as another guy with extra wide (235, I think) racing tires.

[wytbishop]

The other main selling feature of poly for bushings is that it will basically last the life of any vehicle with standard use. Rubber is far less resistant to chemical breakdown and even the cyclic nature of the loading eventually destroys the bonding of rubber. Poly is very chemically resistant and much, much more durable. In racing applications I'm sure there would be some break down, but the lifespan of the bushing would still be off the charts compared to rubber. So assuming one was comfortable with the ride quality, these would be the last bushings you'd ever need to purchase for a particular car.

I am also working on these for sway bar links to replace the stock rubber ones.



These are hardened Chrome-moly spherical bushings and would bolt to the control arm and the sway bar creating a rigid, adjustable link. I'm not sure what these will cost. I could buy the parts from this company and build them myself for probably $40 each, so $160 for a set. I might be able to get them from the supplier assembled for about the same depending how many I buy. If others aren't interested in these I might just make myself a set.

[onlytrueromeo]

All metal endlinks? Wouldn't that hurt the car? There is definitly some sort of rubber bushing in there (stock) to prevent metal to metal contact, right? I'm not just dreaming when I look at the links on my car?

What are the benefits of a thicker, adjustable endlink? I know they're add to the strength of the whole swaybar system, but won't that be just as accomplished by adding a thicker swaybar? I guess it eliminates a weak area, but what else?

[mx-3_4evr]

I want a set of links! I have been trying to make my own but don't know where to start. So I would like the complete set of these. I would pay $160 for the set. PM me about when you can get them by. Thanks!

[wytbishop]

All metal endlinks? Wouldn't that hurt the car? There is definitly some sort of rubber bushing in there (stock) to prevent metal to metal contact, right? I'm not just dreaming when I look at the links on my car?

What are the benefits of a thicker, adjustable endlink? I know they're add to the strength of the whole swaybar system, but won't that be just as accomplished by adding a thicker swaybar? I guess it eliminates a weak area, but what else?

I am also looking into fabricating end links which incorporate a poly bushing, but it will be much more expensive than stock.

The benefits of rigid end links are similar to having stiffer bushings. There is less deformation of the bushing (because there is no bushing) before the sway bar begins to act on the opposite control arm. This will make the anti roll affect more direct and immediate. Some work may have to be done adjusting the length to produce good cornering results and I think this would be most advantageous to racers, but it will help to stiffen up your suspension a bit and will be longer lasting and stronger than the stock items.

If you're not interested in this item I would just stick with gnew stock ones.

[wytbishop]

Bushings arrived last night. First impressions...the quality is good, but the design is suprisingly simple. The trailing arm bushings and one of the Front LCA bushings are of a 2 piece design. I would like to make the LCA bushings one piece for added rigidity but I think the trailing arm bushings can be left as 2 piece because they are quite wide and not as heavily loaded as the rest of the suspension.

Sleeves will have to be machined. This is likely why the bushing kits are so expensive. I think the rubber parts will be relatively cheap...it's the hardware thats gonna bring the price up.

Question: Do you guys want me to supply the bushings with new fasteners? Or would you rather get your own? I am fairly certain that all of my original fasteners are going to be garbage and I wouldn't recommend reusing them anyway. I can probably get a decent deal through work and I'l be buying quantity so I might be able to get a few cents off for that as well. Let me know. Grade 8, Zinc plated Washers, Nuts and Bolts.

[onlytrueromeo]

I would want all the hardware as I find the stores by me have a very limited selection of metric nuts and bolts.

[wytbishop]

I found out today that AWR sells solid adjustable swaybar end links exactly as I was planning to build for probably less than what I could make them for. They look like good quality too. They're made for the Probe/MX 6, but I think they'd fit for us too. I'm going to order a set in the next little while and see how they work.

Metric fasteners are no problem up here in metricland.

[ElectricEnergy]

I would certainly be interested, pending the price. On a complete bushing system. I bet it'll make the car feel like its brand new. I'll keep an eye on your swaybar project as well!

Thanks for putting your a-- on the line for this.

David

[wytbishop]

Initial sketches are done. They're very simple. I'll have them modeled by the end of the weekend and drawings will be done this time next week.

I won't be able to finalize the design until I get the control arms measured up and bushings test fit in them. I am planning on doing that next weekend.

I expect to have a quote by the end of the month.

Still no response from anyone on the color question. If you leave it up to me I'm going to go with Royal Purple.