still burning too much gas...

[mikeinaus]

ive pretty much given up on diagnosis as you can probably tell. every single test ive given this car it has passed with flying colours (other then emissions). yes i am grasping at straws but in my mind there is nothing that can be causing it to run this rich when everything checks out. i think it was you that suggested i go to a de ecu/vaf, and your probably right. but the fact that i spent $80 on a new chip, a chip made by the same person then the one you have in your car, and that your running around 8l/100km is pushing me to believe its something else. no matter how irrational that is or how much it may seem like im slamming my head against a wall i just dont want to believe it. what are the chances that 2 different programmers of 2 different chips, with code based on kl36's programming (ideal ecu) both happen to be duds? especially when my new chip was run in the programmers car for a week for testing before he sent it out. at least now i can say and rationalize to myself that i have replaced everything that could possibly relate to it. im stubborn, when i form an opinion on something its hard to change my mind. ive gone this far, and if i ever fix this problem, i will atleast have the comfort of knowing almost everything in my car is new, rather then almost 20 years old...

ill goto the wreckers this weekend and finally bite the bullet and grab a proper ecu/vaf. hopfully, this is the last question i will have on this matter. my car is a 94 gs, it has the unique disty (7171) that as far as i know only works in 94 (mx3 only?). if i goto a ecu/maf from say a 93 mx6, will my distributor work or would i need to grab the one from said car?

[Ryan]

I'm not running my stoker chip currently. It gives me s--- milage and code 69.

I'm running stock DE ECU/VAF.


You'd have to crosscheck pinouts between the ECU you pickup and your disty pinout. I'm not sure what happens with a 94 disty... I've successfully avoided it in my MX-3 career

[mikeinaus]

if worst comes to worst ill just grab the corresponding distributor when im at the wreckers and test everything in the parking lot.

on a side note, and not to push any boundaries. what would your thoughts be on chipping a de ecu? the main reason i havnt wanted to switch is because of the vris points. my probinator chip had different vris points then my current one and although its a small difference, it was noticeable and wasnt as comfortable of a power band.

on a side note im in the process of installing a tool that will help me figure out the impact of any parts/repairs more quickly. i dont want to say much about it right now but im thinking its going to be popular and everyone is going to want one

[Sleeper6]

if worst comes to worst ill just grab the corresponding distributor when im at the wreckers and test everything in the parking lot.

on a side note, and not to push any boundaries. what would your thoughts be on chipping a de ecu? the main reason i havnt wanted to switch is because of the vris points. my probinator chip had different vris points then my current one and although its a small difference, it was noticeable and wasnt as comfortable of a power band...

So your getting this ecu combo to eliminate problems you had by chipping your original ecu.. now you want to chip the ecu you plan on using as a replacement for the problems caused by a chipped ecu. I dont follow you, am I missing something?

[mikeinaus]

your probably right, my thought process is weird, and like i said im stubborn. my thinking is: k8 ecu is for a 1.8l chipping it makes a crappy equivalent of a 2.5l, now a de ecu is for a 2.5l so chipping it should work better then a chipped k8 ecu no?

then again it makes no sense to me why a chipped ecu would run any worse then a stock ecu. the only programming that should have to do with fuel mixture, and timing control, and control of pretty much everything remains on a stored disk (eprom). changing the eprom, with one that is loaded with the same code as the ideal ecu (kl36) should in theory, run just as good as a kl36 ecu. or am i just completely retarded?

[Nd4SpdSe]

So your getting this ecu combo to eliminate problems you had by chipping your original ecu.. now you want to chip the ecu you plan on using as a replacement for the problems caused by a chipped ecu. I dont follow you, am I missing something?

Nope, he's missing something.

It doesn't matter what ECU you chip, in the end it'll be the same if you chip the K8 or DE ECU, it's the chip that has the programming. Why don't you re-chip your K8 ECU that has the probinator?

[Nd4SpdSe]

then again it makes no sense to me why a chipped ecu would run any worse then a stock ecu. the only programming that should have to do with fuel mixture, and timing control, and control of pretty much everything remains on a stored disk (eprom). changing the eprom, with one that is loaded with the same code as the ideal ecu (kl36) should in theory, run just as good as a kl36 ecu. or am i just completely retarded?

Fuel and timing is everything essential right there; it's the basis of how a motor works and performs

The rest of the ECU retrieves the information from the sensors, interpretes it, calculates, and controls the motor from what it needs to do.

- Eliminate the need of a JE-50 VAF
- Eliminate the worry of having a 115 MPH speed limiter
- Eliminate the check engine light for code 16 (EGR System)
- Provide the correct VRIS points for a KLZE straight neck
- Provide you with a more aggressive fuel/timing map[/quote]

[mikeinaus]

so good news for once. after installing this:


and picking up a kl55 ecu/kl01 vaf ive managed to travel 274km and i still have 3/8ths of a tank of gas left. ive only used the new ecu combo for maybe 100km but my exhaust feels much drier now and it doesn't reak of gas as bad.

if anyone was wondering that screen is a mpg computer. it ties into the vehicle speed sensor and the fire pulse for an injector and can calculate instant mpg/ average mpg as well as a few other things. its extremely useful in picking the ideal gear/ knowing how much gas pedal to use. its still not 100% configured but from what its displaying im averaging around 7.75l/100km.


on a side note. anyone know why the new ecu/vaf would have such a massive effect on my vacuum gauge? with the old setup i could give a fair amount of throttle without a massive effect, now it seems even the slightlest pedal increase brings my vacuum down to like 5in cg...

[Nd4SpdSe]

on a side note. anyone know why the new ecu/vaf would have such a massive effect on my vacuum gauge? with the old setup i could give a fair amount of throttle without a massive effect, now it seems even the slightlest pedal increase brings my vacuum down to like 5in cg...

That's a good thing, it should be that responsive to any little throttle input. It's one of the ways I can tell when my truck is having a bad mood (she needs 02 sensors badly right now) and she retards the timing. When she's in a good mood, I'll watch the gauge and play with the throttle, heh, it'll respond almost like the gauge was attached to it with a cable. When she's in a bad mood, it's like the gauge is molasses filled

Vacuum gauges are great, especially when you already have an understanding on how it reacts to your car when she's working properly.

[mikeinaus]

thats interesting. with like 1/4 or less of the pedal the vacuum gauge goes to like 5, then the last 5 is very forgiving with the throttle, i have to like hammer on it to get it to goto 0... before it was more linear with the pedal. lol at first i thought i caused a vacuum leak or something but i couldnt wrap my head around its behaviour.

[mikeinaus]

ok so changing the ecu to a de one has had little to no impact. my fuel mileage computer is what made the biggest difference. however i have quit my delivery job and im doing more short trips rather then longer drivers so my mileage is getting horrible again. last tank was almost 13l/100km, 350km on 45l of fuel. car starts, idles and runs fine. no stumbling or hesitation however car feels slow to me compared to how most people talk about how fast there ze's are.

tire pressure 45 all the way around, 17" 205-40-17 tires on 18lbs rims
spark plugs wires and disty rotor/cap were all replaced 6 months ago
2 distributors tried no effect
two alternators tried
O2 sensors: checked and replaced
air filter: cleaned and in good condition
all belts/pullies and bearings have been replaced so theres no drag in the belt system
injectors have been replaced
tried 2 aftermarket klze chips for my 94 k8 ecu with no difference, also tried ecu from a 94 mx6 as well as airflow sensor with no improvement
3 different vafs have been tried
2.5" high flow exhaust thats like a year old without any clogs or leaks.
all 4 calipers were taken apart cleaned and greased so there is no drag from them or the e brake cable (even pad wear all the way around)
only cel code refers to egr
fuel pressure/regulator were checked and found in good condition
pcv is new
both coolant temp sensors were replaced and tested in spec
timing is set to 11 degrees
no smoke from exhaust in the light of day
exhaust feels quite humid when i put my hand infront of it and it never gets extremely hot. i can put my hand on my exhaust tip after an hour drive and not get burned...
compression is around 205 on all cylinders
engine is extremely clean under the valve covers and has always been properly maintained.

tps passes the throttle bump test in diagnostic mode however i havnt confirmed its in spec as i cant find my voltmeter at the moment.

things ive observed with real time fuel mileage display. car seems to use less fuel in 5th gear with the engine struggling then it does in a lower gear at same speed, same hill and higher rpm. this is the opposite of what it should be no? im also burning about 5-8l/100km of fuel holding cruise at most speeds on level ground. to make any kind of increase in speed or go up a hill it easily goes over 12l/100km with slight throttle increase. comparing this to my friends 2.5l altima he uses about 1-3l at cruise. i know his car is new but i wouldnt expect that much of a difference from the same size engine.

any other ideas anyone has on what can effect mileage this significantly?

[Ryan]

....get an alignment.

Jack up all 4 corners and spin the wheels by hand. See if anything is seizing/dragging. Good time to check ebrake adjustment too.

[crazycanadian]

I wonder what fuel injectors you have in there??

Also having live graph data of your O2 sensor would help to make sure the car is keeping in fuel control.. It really sucks not being able to get live ECU data... That way you could check fuel trims and see how the computer is managing fuel...

[mikeinaus]

tried 2 different sets of injectors both ze/de ones... bluetops i think they were???

wheels are spinning freely. front bearings are new and the rears are fine. ebrake is not dragging it needs to be tightened if anything. alignment was done last august.

ill see if i can get it hooked up to a labscope Adam. doubt i can get a driving reading with it but i can probably get idle and rev readings, im also not sure if id be able to get screenshots of the data. anything else you suggest i hook into and monitor readings?

[Ryan]

green coolant temp sensor? its cheap.