K-8 EGR problemes and rough idle

MoRf · Post by **MoRf** » March 27th, 2007, 1:38 am

my car is a 1993 gs , stock k-8 5 speed with 288 kms on it.
i have 2 main problems:

1. verry hard start. in the mornings it takes quite a bit of it turing over to get it running and once it starts you get a strong smell of fuel and you have to rev it to keep the idle up or it revs about 300rpm and sometimes stalls.

2. the idle jumps . it idles fine when cold but after the engine is warm the idle settles to 1000 or 700 and then it raises and drops usually from 1300 down to 1000 or 1000 down to 700 it raises and drops quickly. the engine also runs verry rough at low rpms

work i have already done:

1. replaced the intake hose and air box and the air flow sensor.
2. replaced the ERG valve and selinoid
3. new plug wires
I have also checked for vacuum leaks and there arent any i can find and i dont hear any of the normal sucking whistling noises.

right now i have the EGR sensor and silinoid unpluged , also the sensor on the air box and the sensor on the firewall that is also connect with the egr. with these 4 sensors unpluged the idle steadies out at about 1000 and dosent jump(i just unpluged them tonight and went for a short drive to warm the engine).

Do these cars just idle rough lol ?

the only code is 16 the EGR.

thats all i can think of to describe it if anyone has any ideas to help me out i would love here them,

hgallegos915 · Post by **hgallegos915** » March 27th, 2007, 1:43 am

EGR has no effect on idle.. you will get the code for egr if disconnected. Check vacuum leaks and IAC valve. also MAKE SURE you have reset the TPS and idle screw and make sure you have the THROTTLE FLY screws adjusted. Didnt we cover this in an earlier post?

MoRf · Post by **MoRf** » March 27th, 2007, 1:49 am

hgallegos915 wrote:EGR has no effect on idle.. you will get the code for egr if disconnected. Check vacuum leaks and IAC valve. also MAKE SURE you have reset the TPS and idle screw and make sure you have the THROTTLE FLY screws adjusted. Didnt we cover this in an earlier post?

i had the code with the ERG connected and obviously with it disconnected.
there are no vaccuum leaks, where is the IAC located ?
i have adjusted the idle using the ten+grd , but i havent done a tps adjustment or throttle fly screws

hgallegos915 · Post by **hgallegos915** » March 27th, 2007, 2:03 am

Yeah you need to adjust the tps, its a mujst or you will get erratic idle. If you have never messe with the throttle fly screws and you are sure they have not moved dont even mess with them. The IAC is under the throttle body. It tends to either disconnect or get cloggged up or simply go bad. Its what tells your car when its cold and makes the car run richer.

MoRf · Post by **MoRf** » March 27th, 2007, 2:16 am

hgallegos915 wrote:Yeah you need to adjust the tps, its a mujst or you will get erratic idle. If you have never messe with the throttle fly screws and you are sure they have not moved dont even mess with them. The IAC is under the throttle body. It tends to either disconnect or get cloggged up or simply go bad. Its what tells your car when its cold and makes the car run richer.

alright thank you:). i will check the IAC and do the TPS adjustment tomorow.

does it matter if the all EGR sensors are unpluged ? lol. should i do the TPS and make sure the IAC is working properly then reconect the ERG sensors?

ryan_Fuerte · Post by **ryan_Fuerte** » March 27th, 2007, 8:18 am

you might want to check for a major vacuum leak, throw a vacuum gauge on the intake manifold and post your reading, it should be around 17-21 at idle and the need staying still with little movment. If your vac is lower you most likly have a leak. I would first start at the egr gasket, I had the same problem and was hunting all over and never suspected that place. As it is a main source of vacuum and quite a large hole. Have you tested the egr solenoids, if the open the egr to much or at the wrong time the engine runs like sh*t.

good luck with the diagnostics

-Ryan

Quiksilver · Post by **Quiksilver** » March 27th, 2007, 5:28 pm

Now this may be stupid but i had a fairly similar problem and it turned out that i had a big coolant leak and the lack of coolant resulted in this crazy idling....mind you i had some other issues as well.

MoRf · Post by **MoRf** » March 27th, 2007, 7:00 pm

Quiksilver wrote:Now this may be stupid but i had a fairly similar problem and it turned out that i had a big coolant leak and the lack of coolant resulted in this crazy idling....mind you i had some other issues as well.

i already top'd up the coolant levels replaced the colant temp sensor and checked for any leaks.

right now im going to try the tps adjust and swaping on the BAC off my other gs.

i also tryed an ohm meter on both of my BAC's and they both read full open no resistance , so either there both trash or im doing something wrong

lowridah313 · Post by **lowridah313** » March 27th, 2007, 8:19 pm

EGR soleniods located on the right rear of the IM, I had the same problem.
Just grabbed some off a PGT bracket and all, plugged it in, problem solved.

MoRf · Post by **MoRf** » March 27th, 2007, 9:25 pm

lowridah313 wrote:EGR soleniods located on the right rear of the IM, I had the same problem.
Just grabbed some off a PGT bracket and all, plugged it in, problem solved.

yeh i tryed that. the the EGR solenoids the 2 mounted on the bracket? behind the TB on the back/right of the intake manifold. i changed them with the ones off my other GS, but i still have the probleme.

i just finished the TPS adjustment.

now my idle is steady it stays at 800 ish rpms in neutral and 1000 when in gear, but the engine runs verry rough when at idle almost like a misfire

i guess this could be because of my EGR problem?

lowridah313 · Post by **lowridah313** » March 27th, 2007, 9:28 pm

check the ditsy cap for cracks, hell see if you plugs are fouled.

hgallegos915 · Post by **hgallegos915** » March 27th, 2007, 9:30 pm

no no .. egr will not cause this issue.. I have heard SOME PGT ecus.. have the limp mode code for the EGR.. but not the k8 as far as I know. Check other things.. Hows the timing belt? the plugs? how is your fuel filter? when was the last time a major tune up was done? Ive had stupid small problems and the only way i got rid of them was doing a FULL tune up including timing belt change (on k8) Just keep myour patience, these engines can be quite tricky but once u find the problem it will be all smoooooth. Tried another ecu by the way? intake rubber boot leaks?

MoRf · Post by **MoRf** » March 27th, 2007, 10:05 pm

hgallegos915 wrote:no no .. egr will not cause this issue.. I have heard SOME PGT ecus.. have the limp mode code for the EGR.. but not the k8 as far as I know. Check other things.. Hows the timing belt? the plugs? how is your fuel filter? when was the last time a major tune up was done? Ive had stupid small problems and the only way i got rid of them was doing a FULL tune up including timing belt change (on k8) Just keep myour patience, these engines can be quite tricky but once u find the problem it will be all smoooooth. Tried another ecu by the way? intake rubber boot leaks?

Thank you verry much for all the help so far

my neglected mx-3 is starting to come around

ok so i have alot to do , good thing i have ALOT of spare time.

ok so i decided not to fix the EGR the CEL doesn't bother me and the system is useless anyways

lol

the rubber intake boot is almost new no damage what so ever.
i have another ecu in my 94 gs i could try ?( is it much of a job to change them ? i heard that its behind the radio on the floor?)

a timing belt change might be wise, i have no service records for this car ,it was female ownd and maintained, so it has most likely has never been changed

.

ill check the plugs and the fuel filter tomorow.

ariesdude · Post by **ariesdude** » March 27th, 2007, 11:10 pm

If the EGR valve is stuck open due to carbon deposits - the engine wont idle properly and put up EGR codes. The exhaust gases start mixing with intake at idle (not supposed to happen) and make the fuel mix all crazy. You can clean up the EGR valve or replace it or block the EGR pipes so that no exhaust will ever get into the system.

MoRf · Post by **MoRf** » March 27th, 2007, 11:28 pm

ariesdude wrote:If the EGR valve is stuck open due to carbon deposits - the engine wont idle properly and put up EGR codes. The exhaust gases start mixing with intake at idle (not supposed to happen) and make the fuel mix all crazy. You can clean up the EGR valve or replace it or block the EGR pipes so that no exhaust will ever get into the system.

yeh ive though of that . makes alot of sense now it runs rough at idle and it burns ALOT of fuel for a 1.8v6 , my 2000 malibu 3.1L was easier on gas lol.

hmm so EGR or no EGR (thinks real hard) where exactly is the EGR valve it's self ? is it 1 of those 2 sensors mounted on that bracket behind the TB on the intake ? if so i have 2 sets of those and both of them are bad i guess ? or i have some sort of voltage problem

, and what is the best way to clean them ? carb cleaner or something like that ?

MX-3.com

K-8 EGR problemes and rough idle

K-8 EGR problemes and rough idle

crazy mx-3s

Re: crazy mx-3s