would this be stupid??

Joey's mx · Post by **Joey's mx** » December 11th, 2005, 3:07 pm

Ok i found this picture....and i was wondering, would be a good idea to make a 4 cylinder turbo header?? I was thinking of keeping the same design(turbo mounts on the side of the motor).....no would that be a bad thing to do for a turbo setup??? Would it be best to keep the turbo as close to the head as possible?? I am trying to design a better manifold for the 1.6L DOHC motors!!

BuGS · Post by **BuGS** » December 11th, 2005, 4:10 pm

Not really Stupid, if I remember JWMotorsports made a manifold like that. But The reason V6 guys do that is because they have no room in front of the motor, only to the side.

Joey's mx · Post by **Joey's mx** » December 11th, 2005, 5:25 pm

I was just thinking that way because i have the probe 2.0L header and it would a perfect setup to design it that way using that header!!!

Franko · Post by **Franko** » December 11th, 2005, 11:19 pm

It is my understanding that you arent supposed to have the manifold runners too long due to the fact that you loose heat energy which helps drive the turbine. Loosing too much heat before the turbo will cause there to be a considerable increase in turbo lag.

ariesdude · Post by **ariesdude** » December 12th, 2005, 12:24 am

Franko wrote: loose heat energy which helps drive the turbine.

Franko wrote:Loosing too much heat before the turbo will cause there to be a considerable increase in turbo lag.

Please correct me if i am wrong - I thought the exhaust gas pressure drives the turbine blades which turns the compressor to compress incoming air. I never thought of exhaust heat energy being converted into boost. I thought Long runners and too many bends reduce exhaust pressure and make the system inefficient.

Franko · Post by **Franko** » December 12th, 2005, 3:52 am

Well according to corky bell.. This is how it is.

Also why else would products like this exist..
Behold!

ariesdude · Post by **ariesdude** » December 12th, 2005, 3:51 pm

LOL... good one... I am going to get a bunch of those and cover my entire engine - i am also going to remove the radiator so there is no heat loss at all

that should put me in the 3500 HP range

But seriously if anyone wants to know how turbos work -
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/turbo1.htm

Franko · Post by **Franko** » December 12th, 2005, 8:31 pm

I dont fully understand it either, Im just tellin it how it is. Read maximum boost if you dont believe me.

XxantwawnxX · Post by **XxantwawnxX** » December 12th, 2005, 8:36 pm

Thats also why using HEATWRAP on headers increased hp a lil and decreses under hood temps, but increases in pipe temp.

D323 · Post by **D323** » December 14th, 2005, 2:15 am

Actually you want to keep your exhaust gasses hot. Hot gas flows MUCH faster than cold gasses. Thats why header wraps work well... they reduce under hood temps to keep charge pipes cool, but also keep the hot active gas moving down the pipe.

In a long pipe such as that, the gas has more time to cool, and slows the cooler it gets. This is what creates the turbo lag. slower gas = more gas needed to spool the turbo = more lag.

Franko · Post by **Franko** » December 14th, 2005, 7:04 am

Eurka!
It all makes sense. Since the hot gasses are less dense they take up more space and make more pressure to push the turbine with. It cools down and gets more dense taking up less space. Why didnt I think of it sooner.

BuGS · Post by **BuGS** » December 14th, 2005, 11:01 am

Franko wrote:Eurka!
It all makes sense. Since the hot gasses are less dense they take up more space and make more pressure to push the turbine with. It cools down and gets more dense taking up less space. Why didnt I think of it sooner.

lol, I tried explaining that to someone, they still didn't get it.

But ya, especially with Small displacement engines, you need to keep your turbo as close as possible for "Maximum" performance, But if you want to keep your probe header, I don't see why not just make a "uppipe" and go from there. But it might actually be cheaper to just get the Stock B6 turbo manifold and then use that turbo then sell off the probe header...

jaydog5678 · Post by **jaydog5678** » December 14th, 2005, 12:26 pm

To add, I don't think a header wrap would be wise. Reason being is because of thermal stress on the header itself. It is possible to get it so hot that the manifold will crack. Heat is good, but too much is not a good thing.

BuGS · Post by **BuGS** » December 15th, 2005, 12:30 am

jaydog5678 wrote:To add, I don't think a header wrap would be wise. Reason being is because of thermal stress on the header itself. It is possible to get it so hot that the manifold will crack. Heat is good, but too much is not a good thing.

It has been shown, time and time again if the material your Header/exhaust manifold is made out of is quality, then Heat wrap is just fine. Usually crappy quality material or design is what makes them crack. RX7 guys have done countless tests of SSautochrome vs custom SS headers and whatnot. Good quality stuff lasts.

Josh · Post by **Josh** » December 15th, 2005, 2:03 am

jaydog5678 wrote:To add, I don't think a header wrap would be wise. Reason being is because of thermal stress on the header itself. It is possible to get it so hot that the manifold will crack. Heat is good, but too much is not a good thing.

yah i dont agree at all.

your turbo is going to get all the heat it neads being hooked up to the exhaust (anywhere in the exhaust). it is best the closer to the motor as possable. but header wrap a bad thing, not even. definatly a good thing.

i persionally wouldent go with the Probe header, but it might help by running just a little cooler, as the air from the turbo to your motor will be cooler because the long header will disperse some of that heat before it reaches the turbo. but i would definatly wrap it if your going to use the probe header. why not just buy a Miata ss Turbo manifold off of e-bay, and put some renforced welds down on it. they Fit under the hood! and you could sell you probe header to someone who is N/A.