Sticky Idle When Warm Answer

Robotaz · Post by **Robotaz** » June 28th, 2005, 3:58 pm

I just wanted to let anyone who cares know how i fixed my idle problem. The classic problem where you come out of the strip club because the chicks aren't pretty and your car over-revs and seems to be better when you briskly tap the throttle. The problem continues until the car gets out and runs for a bit. Stuck in traffic with this problem will get ya frazzled. Well, after trying a $300 Idle Air Control Valve, I know how to fix the problem, and it's not by replacing the IAC, hopefully.

First off, your probably like me and out of room to adjust the idle air adjustment screw. Disconnect the battery, then the IAC electrical connector(directly under where accelerator cable attachs to throttle). Next unscrew the screw up about 3/4 of the way from the bottom(Since you'll be screwing inward to lower throttle it will end up fairly close to halfway). Reattach the electical connector, then connect the battery. Adjusting the screw while the engine's on will always force you out of adjustment room, so don't do it until you've moved the screw with the engine off.

Choose a lube spray that stays or becomes liquid when warm. A good example of a lube to use would be silicone spray, or even wd-40. A bad example would be Teflon lube spray that dries. In many cases the teflon spray rules, but we need the liquid properties that this lube just doesn't have. Anyway, put a paper towel behind the throttle cable and lube the crap out of the cable while opening and closing the throttle, and also by placing the lube spray aiming-straw-nozzle-thing up in the cable.

Go test to see if the problem is solved, even with the A/C and all that good stuff. If its good, congrats.

If it still sucks, while hot and over-revving, manually push the throttle closed all of the way and see if the idle comes down. Mine did*. Then I moved the accelerator cable closer to the throttle body by turning the nuts where the cable mounts to the TB a total of only two turns. This fixed my problem. Yours may take more, but try small increments of turns. Im currently removing the new IAC valve. Total fix about 50 cents in lube spray.

* NOTE: I am assumming that your throttle plate and IAC are clean and functional. Test the IAC resistance for a absolute answer regarding its functionality and clean the plate with TB cleaner(use a SOFT toothbrush if it has hardened deposits). Take the TB off with the IAC on it. I made a new gasket for $5 from Autozone. It all comes apart very easily with the battery and air intake hose taken out.

ccreech · Post by **ccreech** » June 28th, 2005, 4:16 pm

The actual cable? How does that fix the problem. What did you diagnose was causing the problem? That the plate wasn't closing all the way? How does lubing the cable help this. Don't get me wrong I am not questioning that it works...I am gonna go try it I just haven't been able to get my head around this problem for quite some time.

Robotaz · Post by **Robotaz** » June 28th, 2005, 4:24 pm

I diagnosed the problem by seeing that the throttle could be forced further shut by hand when it was over-revving, which I stated previously. The spring on the throttle could cause it, too. Additionally, carbon in the TB could restrict movement.

Basically there's no more to say, read my post again to check the paragraph that i added. Or, describe your problem and what you've done to fix it and I'll try to help. This drove me absolutely nuts, too.

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » June 28th, 2005, 8:13 pm

Robotaz wrote:I just wanted to let anyone who cares know how i fixed my idle problem. The classic problem where you come out of the strip club because the chicks aren't pretty and your car over-revs and seems to be better when you briskly tap the throttle. The problem continues until the car gets out and runs for a bit. Stuck in traffic with this problem will get ya frazzled. Well, after trying a $300 Idle Air Control Valve, I know how to fix the problem, and it's not by replacing the IAC, hopefully.
How about just disconnecting the IAC connector??

First off, your probably like me and out of room to adjust the idle air adjustment screw.
Correct, a sneeze away from completely closed.
Disconnect the battery, then the IAC electrical connector(directly under where accelerator cable attachs to throttle).
What's your reasoning for this, or was this just a shot in the dark?

Next unscrew the screw (what screw? - the idle air adjust screw?) until about 25% of total screwing distance is left (confused? - do you mean turn idle air adjust screw out (CCW) until 75% of the way out - confirm?) (Since you'll be screwing inward to lower throttle it will end up fairly close to halfway) (again confused? - is it because you will be turning the idle air adjust screw in (CW) from 3/4 out to approx 1/2 way out - confirm). Reattach the electical connector ( you mean the IAC connector, correct?), then connect the battery (still not sure what you gain by disconnecting the battery. Are trying to fool the ecu into not recognizing these changed adjustments?). Adjusting the screw while the engine's on will always force you out of adjustment room, (of course it will because the ecu is always making corrections and compensations based on basic programming and sensor inputs) so don't do it (do what?...sorry, confused again) until you've moved the screw with the engine off. (I think I know what you mean but not 100%)

Choose a lube spray that stays or becomes liquid when warm. A good example of a lube to use would be silicone spray, or even wd-40 (not sure that I would ever want to introduce WD40 into a TB. I'm sure there are a few other alternatives here.) . A bad example would be Teflon lube spray that dries. In many cases the teflon spray rules, but we need the liquid properties that this lube just doesn't have. Anyway, put a paper towel behind the throttle cable and lube the crap out of the cable while opening and closing the throttle. (How about a graphite lubricant?)

Go test to see if the problem is solved, even with the A/C and all that good stuff. If its good, congrats.

If it still sucks, while hot and over-revving, manually push the throttle closed all of the way and see if the idle comes down. Mine did*. Then I moved the accelerator cable closer to the throttle body by turning the nuts where the cable mounts to the TB a total of only two turns. (I've already determined that the excessive engine bay heat causing metal expansions equated to reducing the amount of throttle cable free play as opposed to when the engine is cold. I currently run with a significant amount of free play in the throttle cable easily detectable when the engine is cold, obviously.) This fixed my problem. Yours may take more, but try small increments of turns. Im currently removing the new IAC valve. Total fix about 50 cents in lube spray.

* NOTE: I am assumming that your throttle plate and IAC are clean and functional. Test the IAC resistance for a absolute answer regarding its functionality and clean the plate with TB cleaner(use a SOFT toothbrush if it has hardened deposits). Take the TB off with the IAC on it. I made a new gasket for $5 from Autozone. It all comes apart very easily with the battery and air intake hose taken out.
(Done all of that and even then some - complete TB overhaul with new Mazda gasket between TB and lower IAC unit. Attached link will give more details and a further thread by me has approached similar issues. Bottom line answer that I'm using today - DISCONNECTED IAC, until I can find another KL68 TB that's not a POS like mine.)

Perhaps if you could review this and tell me your findings?
http://www.mx-3.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=43237
Thanks.

XxantwawnxX · Post by **XxantwawnxX** » June 28th, 2005, 8:16 pm

i just adjusted the little Throttlecable bolt adjuster thing (gave it a tad bit more slack) and that fixed my prob.

Robotaz · Post by **Robotaz** » June 28th, 2005, 10:02 pm

Just follow the instructions. References to a screw when only one type of screw has been mentioned seem simple to understand if you're used to writing or reading grammatically correct statements. Clearly there are some pissed off people regarding this issue. Also, I never said spray lube in your freakin TB dammit.

The slack in your cable isn't gonna matter if the cable needs to be lubed. I would remove the cable at the mount and spray down the cable if it hadn't worked without removing already.

Just curious, does this special TB work the same as stock? The cable that goes from the throttle to the tranny on stock had to be tightened on mine. Tying a loose knot in the wire to take up some slack fixed the prob. Before, it caused my tranny to shift like crap. It really has to be perfect coming from accelerator pedal and tranny to the throttle. You don't really want slack with either, but not enough throws off the idle and tranny shifting.

There are still more things to try so let us know.

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » June 28th, 2005, 11:25 pm

Since it appears you have solved your own idle issues, I'd like to hear if any, any subsequent side-effects that may be encountered, ie, rich running, possible loss of power at various rpm ranges, etc. Although I don't recall your configuration, just confirm you are referring to a V6 or I4, ATX or MTX, it will make a difference. You can see my configuration in my signature. My appologies for the lube in the TB.

Robotaz · Post by **Robotaz** » June 28th, 2005, 11:52 pm

I have a 93 GS with an ATX and 168000 miles. I haven't had any side effects of the changes. Everything, other than a code 16 CEL due to the EGR solenoids not working, is fine on the car. It really just had an idle prob. No hunting probs, just over-revving.

ccreech · Post by **ccreech** » June 29th, 2005, 9:56 am

Just follow the instructions. References to a screw when only one type of screw has been mentioned seem simple to understand if you're used to writing or reading grammatically correct statements.

I asked you what you found the problem to be. not how to fix it. Or are you incapable of reading grammatically correct statements either?

(Just Playing). You said spray the cable with a lubricant. I want to know why that fixes the problem. (ie. Where was there friction that needed lubricating?)

I diagnosed the problem by seeing that the throttle could be forced further shut by hand when it was over-revving

You must have seen or felt the cable not releasing fully to try to spray lube on it...just wondering where its catching at?

Clearly there are some pissed off people regarding this issue

Who is pissed? I haven't seen anyone do anything more than ask questions to clear up confusion...Myself included. We're not hating...We're participating...twinkle twinkle baby, twinkle twinkle!

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » June 29th, 2005, 11:01 am

Chris, have you got ongoing high idle issues also? What TB are you running? And are you still running the straight neck ZE IM?

Robotaz · Post by **Robotaz** » June 29th, 2005, 5:12 pm

I hadn't noticed until today, but the cable of course is laying on the intake in a pretty sharp turn. For whatever reason the heat and the cable bend must be causing the friction. Spray down the cable so that it gets to that bend and i'm pretty sure it'll be good to go. Do this by sliding the cable out where it mounts and adjusts with the two little nuts that are on the cable, like the guy earlier said he did, and lift the cable and spray down and into it. The one thing that i noticed today is that when lubed enough to fix the prob, the cable will travel back and forth, in and out, just by turning the throttle where the cable attaches(when reassembled). I'm pretty sure, if yours does this correctly, that the cable isn't your problem if it still over-revs.

And jschrauwen, you answered every question from your first post that you asked, and then answered to yourself, correctly. The ECU believes that the adjusted screw position is the same spot as before adjustment. Some cars don't have a cpu that needs for the part to be disconnected. Turning the car off might be enough for our cars, but its safest to do it the way I was suggesting earlier. I don't think cars use RAM, except for crap they call "fuzzy logic", so it probably boils down to whether your car's cpu sleeps or not. If it sleeps, most likely your adjustment will confuse the computer if you don't disconnect battery and IAC connector, leading to undesirable "limp" mapping from the computer. Which i guess would result in your IAC overcompensating for the new idle screw position, which i guess is what got all of our idle screws so far down to begin with. Anyway...

Tell us how it checks out.

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Sticky Idle When Warm Answer

Sticky Idle When Warm Answer

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