A dark day in Eunos800 (Xedos 9) land. Not 200HP

[Cage]

Ok. …………This is a call out to all who can prove me wrong. And I hope you can….. Because, I really want to be wrong this time. The Eunos 800 is on trial (aka. Xedos 9) It has been a debate that has ended in the past with moderators stating that the Eunos 800 is a KL-ZE engine @ 200HP. And even our favorite moderator has stated that this engine produces 200HP. And Street imports sells this engine as 200HP. I call my first witness: http://www.fastlane.com.au/reviews/eunos800.htm. The reviewer states the engine has 125kW @ 6000rpm. Torque: 215Nm @ 4800rpm.
The conversion is: horsepower (metric) = 1.3596 kw X 125kw = 170 horsepower.
My second witness: http://216.239.39.120/translate_c?hl=en&u=http://www.mazda.de/drive/xedos/xedos_daten.asp%3Fmodelname%3DXedos%2B9%2B2,5i%2BV6%2BExclusive&prev=/search%3Fq%3DXEDOS%2B9%2B%26hl%3Den% 26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26sa%3DG This is a brochure request for a 1997. This time the engine is rated at 120kw 163 horsepower.
My third witness: http://www.xedos6.co.uk/spec25.html
http://eunos500.jp/member/nick/index.html
http://www.kaico.net/mazda_Zedos.html from this you can see that the compression is 9:2:1 not 10:1 . The only reference I have found to for a 10:1 is a 160 hp 2.0 KF-ZE
Here is another that claims only 167. bhp. http://www.histomobile.com/1/Xedos/1994/9.htm?lan=1 <p>This is my final piece of hard cold truth from the PDF files of Mazda.com http://www.media.mazda.com/press_info/mazda_xedos9/xedos9_pressinfo.pdf this document clearly states it is a KL-ZE (GOOD NEWS) 2.5 V6 from a Xedos 9 (Eunos 800) is a 9:2:1 (BAD NEWS)compression engine with 164 bhp.(BAD NEWS)
Awaiting the defense to call its first witness (Eunos 800 ZE engine owners and moderators). Oh….this is a 2001 model. <p>Question: It is clear that the Eunos 800 (Xedos 9) has a little more torque but is it really worth getting a Eunos 800 over a Aspec Mx-6 or 626 from a local junkyard?
I guess the good news is that an Eunos can be force induced (4-5 psi) due to the lower compression. You tell me. Man this sucks we have been shorted 33 horsepower !!!!<p>A little hope can come from this site http://www.millenia.mazda.co.jp/spec04.html It states the KL-ZE has 140kw or 190ps 190hp. But the compression is 9:2 not 10:1. the Japan millennia is called the MS8 and if I have correct information will not fit unless you use your intake manifold from you 1.8.

[pelado]

Thank you. This is what I have believed for some time, that the curved neck IM KLZE's are nothing more than US spec Millenia engines with the KL-ZE designation, which to Mazda apparently means nothing more than a KL engine destined for the Pacific countries.
The only true 200ps engine is the straight neck ZE with KL31 cams.

[davidosk024]

sorry your both wrong<p>i just bought a eunos 800 engine with 200hp
with a ms8 manifold on it.<p>thing deffinatly is around 200hp.
do the math though, 150kw in hp is around
195hp which is correct anyways.<p>Worst case when my car gets on the dyno
ill know, and if its not im taking it back for
a free proper replacement.

[davidosk024]

also note,<p>that the last article you posted
http://www.media.mazda.com/press_info/mazda_xedos9/xedos9_pressinfo.pdf<p>is what was going to europe.... which really doesnt mean anything. as europe has different compliance and specs to the USA and Australia
and Canada... etc...etc...

[davidosk024]

And look at the specs sheet at the bottom of that pdf..<p>the engine is a KLD

[davidosk024]

my 1.8 ltr engine runs at 100kw standard<p>the 2.5 i put it DEFFINATLY HAS ALOT
more then 20 more kilowats total<p>especially if im taking it to supercharged v6
commodores here and other cars like
mx-6s and probes.

[David Coleman]

Michel Fortier got a curved neck KL01 cammed KLZE and he put down 172whp. And I've never seen a KLDE get compression figures above 200psi like mine sure did.

[IanL]

Cage - now I make your day!<p>Pelado - sorry, but its 147 kW (200ps) JDM<p>http://syuninracing.k-server.org/pripri/huzii.html<p>http://members.tripod.co.jp/millenia25s/millenia.htm - Scroll down between pics 3 & 4<p>And, for interest, officially, the current production (190ps, CR 9.2):
http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/urltrurl?lp=ja_en&u rl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.millenia.mazda.co.jp%2Fspec04.html<p>The defence rests!<p>[ February 18, 2003: Message edited by: IanL ]</p>

[Manach]

http://www.ask.com/main/metaAnswer.asp?t=ai&s=a&MetaEngine=directhit&en=te&eo=4&o=0&frames=True&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Epumaracing%2Eco%2Euk%2Fpower1%2Ehtm&ac=1&adcat=auto&pt=Puma+R ace+Engines+Technical+Guide+%2D+Power+and+Torque+%2D+how+they+are&dm=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Epumaracing%2Eco%2Euk%2Fpower1%2Ehtm&io=2&qid=C86DB116F1EC444DAE9A5CA52CDB9C5D&back=ask%3Dhow %2Bdo%2BI%2Bconvert%2BHorse%2BPower%2Binto%2BPS%253F%26o%3D0%26qsrc%3D1%26meta%3D1&ask=how+do+I+convert+Horse+Power+into+PS%3F&dt=030218125327&amt=&pg=1&qsrc=1<p>
Found out that HP is 98.6% of PS.<p>So 200PS is in fact 197.2BHP. Hope that could help.

[Cage]

Can someone clear this up? :
MS8 is not an Eunos 800(xedos 9)it is a Japan Millina @ 200ps which = 197.26 HP <p>So if you buy an eunos 800 from 1993 to 1997 non miller cycle you will have 164 to 167 HP not 197 to 200hp. The millina from japan has a different intake and the KL-31 Cams it apears but it is not an Eunos 800 that we seek for our Mx-3. we can not ignore the information from mazda. also I found that powerchip http://www.powerchipgroup.com/products/showchip.asp?pid=Maz0050 lists the engine (eunos800) at 125kw = 169.95HP Please send out your links for proof. Also if you have an MS8 please post a pic of your intake mani.<p>CAGE

[Cage]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by davidosk024:
And look at the specs sheet at the bottom of that pdf..<p>the engine is a KLD<hr></blockquote><p>yes... but if you read the top part of the pdf you will see that mazda called this the KL-ZE I think the KLD is a generic ref

[David Coleman]

You guys keep posting links from aftermarket companies, which may not necessarily know as much as, say, Mazda of Japan about these engines. Mazda of Japan rates Millenias at 200ps, which is 197hp. Several people in North America have dyno'd Millenia 2.5L motors that were sourced from Japan at ~170whp, which means at the crank they're around 200bhp. <p>This is the only evidence I see that is acceptable proof, not what Joe's chip tuners in Bangladesh has on his ghetto Frontpage 98 website.

[Cage]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by davidosk024:
sorry your both wrong<p>i just bought a eunos 800 engine with 200hp
with a ms8 manifold on it.<p>thing deffinatly is around 200hp.
do the math though, 150kw in hp is around
195hp which is correct anyways.<p>Worst case when my car gets on the dyno
ill know, and if its not im taking it back for
a free proper replacement.<hr></blockquote><p>Where did you get 150kw from? most of the articls say 120kw to 123kw x 1.3596 = 163hp to 167hp. can you post pics of the ms-8 manifold ?

[Cage]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by IanL:
Cage - now I make your day!<p>Pelado - sorry, but its 147 kW (200ps) JDM<p>http://syuninracing.k-server.org/pripri/huzii.html<p>http://members.tripod.co.jp/millenia25s/millenia.htm - Scroll down between pics 3 & 4<p>And, for interest, officially, the current production (190ps, CR 9.2):
http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/urltrurl?lp=ja_en&u rl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.millenia.mazda.co.jp%2Fspec04.html<p>The defence rests!<p>[ February 18, 2003: Message edited by: IanL ]<hr></blockquote><p>That is not an eunos 800 (xedos 9). It is a japan Millina 25 (MS8) I do think that the millenia 25 has 190hp but only from 2000 to present. your evidence is thrown out. hehe sorry <p>[ February 18, 2003: Message edited by: Cage ]</p>

[Cage]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by David Coleman:
You guys keep posting links from aftermarket companies, which may not necessarily know as much as, say, Mazda of Japan about these engines. Mazda of Japan rates Millenias at 200ps, which is 197hp. Several people in North America have dyno'd Millenia 2.5L motors that were sourced from Japan at ~170whp, which means at the crank they're around 200bhp. <p>This is the only evidence I see that is acceptable proof, not what Joe's chip tuners in Bangladesh has on his ghetto Frontpage 98 website.<hr></blockquote><p>Mr. Coleman
I agree that there is a alot of ghetto sites with incorrect informantion. But the pdf is from mazda Japan. They say the Japan version of the 1999 mazda millina quote "it provides a top output of 120kw (146ps) @6000rpm this math is = to 163 hp.<p>The reason I posted this is because people are being mislead, and I am tired of seeing everybody posting numbers with no paper trail to back it up. I think as Eunos 800 engine owners, we want to belive that we got what we paid for, but the evidence is overwelming. I totaly agree with your statement that alot of sites have incorrect information, but they all can't be wrong. Not once have I found anything supporting 200HP for the eunos 800 (xedos 9).I think as mad as hell as it makes us feel, the eunos 800 is not 200hp and is not 10.1. It is stamped KL31 and mazda calls it a KL-ZE, but the specs that mazda places is 9.2:1 with 164 to 170hp. Depending on the year of the engine. The case is not closed the jury is still out if you will. come on Coleman you can do better than that :p Oh and the MS8 is the Millenia 25 not the Eunos 800 (xedos 9)Unless I am wrong and if so can you provide a link?
Thanks<p>Cage<p>[ February 18, 2003: Message edited by: Cage ]</p>