At last, MX-6 ECU + KL02 vs. Probinator + JE50 dyno results.

[Nd4SpdSe]

But that seems impossible because they give different readings from what I know, so that means it'll need 2 fuel tables and be able to differentiate between JE50 and KL02.

EDIT: Just a random thought, what if the K8 ECU is different from the KL01 hardware-wise? I'm pretty sure the probinator wasn't tested in a K8 ECU, so that might be the problem. Does anyone have a probinator chipped KL ECU?

Indeed, but that's how he says it.

Depends, It has been done many times, I just sold my K8 Probinator'd ECU. You can't put a chip in the early '92's, it uses different circuitry.

[Mad Cow]

But that seems impossible because they give different readings from what I know, so that means it'll need 2 fuel tables and be able to differentiate between JE50 and KL02.

EDIT: Just a random thought, what if the K8 ECU is different from the KL01 hardware-wise? I'm pretty sure the probinator wasn't tested in a K8 ECU, so that might be the problem. Does anyone have a probinator chipped KL ECU?

Indeed, but that's how he says it.

Depends, It has been done many times, I just sold my K8 Probinator'd ECU. You can't put a chip in the early '92's, it uses different circuitry.

I know that, my car came with one of those. So you're saying that you know people have run a curved-neck probinator chip in a KL ECU?

[Nd4SpdSe]

I don't actually, but why would it make a difference? Changing the chip changes the ECU basically, so it shouldn't make any different, K8 or KL, but you never know.

[solo_ryder]

I had a chipped kl01 ecu in my black car running a kl02 vaf.. Didn't help much for mileage. But that chip was for a de with ze curved neck intake mani, weird combo

[RX8SE3P]

Yeah rx8, we know that - lol, we're not stupid.

I'll give you guys benefit of the doubt

[stoker100]

with the MX3 because it runs the JE50 VAF you should be able to throw in a KL31/KL36 EPROM, if you have a 93' it will be plug and play, if you have a 94-95' you will need to add the wire for the ECTS (pretty easy), if you have a 95' you will need a disty with both hall effect sensors. not sure how many MX3's have tried this, i know i tried the KL31 on my probe and it ran rich, on another MX3 it also ran rich.

probinator from what i have seen for the probe/MX6 took a KL85 EPROM and put the ZE fuel map in, set the ZE VRIS and i believe changed the timing. for the probinator that uses the JE50 (now im only speculating) he would have used a MX3 eprom and modified it accordingly, from what i have seen nobody knows everything about the ECU and therefore any multipliers may have been missed throwing the timing/fuel maps off course from what the real ZE is.

i myself do custom tuning myself and from what i have learnt from other members on PT i can say its no easy take to modify one EPROM to work for a different engine. i think for those running ZE's we should try to work out why the stock KL31/KL36 ECU's run rich, from there we should be able to use the KLZE EPROMs to get the gains we expect. for those interested in the work involved see my eprom tuning thread on PT:
http://forums.probetalk.com/showthread. ... prom+tuner" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Nd4SpdSe]

Buddy, people have been running KL31/36 ECU's in ZE's longer than I've owned an Mx-3, and those were literally the only options up until a few years ago until the Probinator.

The Probinator came out to replace the KL31/36 ECU's for these reasons:
- A $40 substitute to a $250 ECU
- Probe/Mx-6 owner can use their stock ECU rather than sourcing a JE50 from an Mx-3
- Those running Curved-Neck intake manifolds, specifically those with ZE Mx-3's, can get the proper VRIS configuration

Probinator told me directed, after I asked him, that he runs a modified ZE map.

From my, and the local Mx-3'ers experience, the KL31/36 ECU's run white and clean, far from rich. I find it funny that only in the last few months, Mx-3'ers are complaining how they run rich. The ECU's don't change, they either work or they don't, with the odd rare time of funky problems. I would arribute it to something else, either old or worn O2 sensors, or the VAF's are starting to get old and worn as well. I don't see the ECU's being an issue with a rich mixture.

[Whisper]

Well, in my case it would have to be the VAF, since I've not changed anything else, and somehow I doubt the VAF would make much difference at WOT and redline anyway, as at that point it becomes just another pipe.

Anyway, I asked Ryan, and from what he said I understand that Probinator for JE50 VAF is specific to JE50 VAF and K8 ECU and not meant to work with KL02.

Now, if stoker can figure out better mapping, then that'll be the optimal low budget solution.

[stoker100]

Nd4SpdSe im not doubting probinator came along with a good option as a replacement for the true ZE ECU and JE50, but i can tell you from the probinator and KL31/KL36 EPROMs i have that probinator copied the ZE fuel enrichment map (unmodified).

ive been running a ZE for over 5 years now, i only recently acquired a KL36 ECU and when i found it ran rich (at WOT) i did a search on here, MX6 and PT, many posters came back with the same running rich issue on the KLZE ECU's, its not just recently people have noticed this its been going on for years. i had white plugs after pulling them after idle too, a DYNO and WOT pulls showed that while idle conditions are lean WOT was not. plugs were pulled the day after the dyno where i wan at 10:1 on a KL36:
http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm28 ... plugsa.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Whisper, let us know how you go with the VAF and if it runs any better.

ive been running a new tune on my car recently, ill be sending it to another friend with a ZE soon to see how he goes, so far testing has shown a large midrange improvement in my car over my previous tune, top end tuning will be done on the dyno next time i get a chance.

[Nd4SpdSe]

Nd4SpdSe im not doubting probinator came along with a good option as a replacement for the true ZE ECU and JE50, but i can tell you from the probinator and KL31/KL36 EPROMs i have that probinator copied the ZE fuel enrichment map (unmodified).

Than he lied to me.

Just wondering what maps you use in your chips?

modified ze maps.

[speedmazda]

quick question after reading this thread guys..

if the chip you have is designed for the k8 computer specifically.. than your best bet would be to stick with the JE-50 sensor correct?

now.. i've got a probe/mx-6 designed chip in my k8 ecu.. and im still running the JE-50 sensor. the car is still running a tad rich but a lot better than the other stock k8 ecu i have.

my question is this, is it correct to assume that by having the chip designed for the probe/mx-6, it would run leaner by using the KL-02 sensor?

just trying to determine for sure before i purchase one, as i've read some guys tried the Kl-02 on their setup and it made no difference if not made it worse.. just wondering if this is on the mx-3 designed chip specifically?

thanks.

[solo_ryder]

If anyone is running a k801 or k8 style ecu and its chipped then yes the je50 needs to be used. That was proved earlier in this thread.

However, if you have a kl ecu that is chipped with a mx6/probe eprom you should be able to run either vaf IIRC. Not sure about a k8 series ecu with a mx6/probe chip though as the ecu is built for the je50. The eprom for the probes and mx6s are built to accomadate both airflow sensors (iirc what I read on the probinator site and pt).

But, that doesn't really help us mx3 guys as the vris points are goin to be off as those chips are made for straight neck motors.

The reason that the chip can accomodate 2 different vafs is that the jdm mx6 runs a je50.. Most probe guys don't have a je50 so the chip designer made it possible for the ecu to correspond to the kl02 vaf to not only make it easier for probe guys, but proly as a selling point as they would not need to source a je50 vaf.

Does running kl02 vaf on a mx6/probe chipped ecu make a difference compared to running a je50 with the same ecu? Who knows, theoretically it shouldn't matter right. But you never know.. Try it out and see if your mileage/power improves.


Another point for the discussion between nd4spd and stroker. I agree with u fully stoker. I ran a kl36 on my last ze and it ran pig rich at wot, like 10a/f or lower (aem uego can only read as low as 10). This was on a wideband. I had good power on the top end.

Installed a de ecu with chip and kl02 and the af's cleaned up to around 12.2-13.9 afs at wot. However, the top end seemed less powerfull and the fuel mileage increased maybe 20km per tank.. Maybe.

I wish I still had my wb02 so I could test my current ecu. I am gonna try a de ecu/vaf combo soon and see what happens. I also get to try out my brothers "magic" ecu soon. A kl49 94 probe ecu with a probinator for a straight neck, on a kl02. Gets over 600km to a tank with a non working 2nd vris. He can keep up well with me in my ze with working vris.

[Mooneggs]

so I have a couple of kl01 ecu's laying around... and I need to get a second probinator so maybe I'll try and get it chipped and see what probinator says.

[_-Night-Shade-_]

Any updates on this?

I'll be throwing in my ZE very soon and this is still an issue that I need to address. I want to order a chip from Probinator. However I want to:

1) Avoid the whole extra coolant sensor issue seeing as I have a 94
2) Get the proper ECU/VAF/Chip combo to run fine

What I've got in my setup is a Millenia Curved Neck IM, KL31 Cams, and I have both a JE50 and a KL02 VAF that I can use. I'm currently talking with him to see what's up but he doesn't seem to be understanding the issue, he says if I have a 94 ecu then the sensors shouldn't be a problem. Haven't all of you guys talked to him about this before? Why is he acting like he doesn't know? Is he on crack?

[solo_ryder]

I guess noone asked him for a few reasons...

1. There are not many 94+ swaps pre 2008 or 2009 compared to 92-93 cars
2. Only recently did most of us realize that 94+ klde ecus don't require the extra sensor
3. Everyone assumed that the chipped ecu's required the extra sensor even though most ze's come with no sensors.

Igor and I had a interesting discussion today and basically it has just come down to the ze chip for the mx3 that has caused these issues, it seems probinator hasn't programmed the chips for 94+ mx3s that only use one sensor.