millenia s motor swap, possible y or n?
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 1:00 am
has this swap ever been attempted or has everyone just ruled it out completely due to the power and availability of the kl-ze over the millenia motor?
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millenia s motor swap, possible y or n?
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Posted: January 15th, 2007, 1:16 am
i dont think anyone has tried but most say its just a bit on the big side of things
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 1:20 am
no.
well, yes, possible.
probable? no.
the GS tranny DOES bolt up to the KJ, however... in case you were wondering.
the halfshaft/jackshaft does not bolt to the KJ block- plus a whole host of other hassles.
not to mention the fact that you cant really get any more power out of the KJ than its already putting down. Only a few more than the KL.
For all the hassle - the KL is a much better option. Easy to bolt in and lots of parts for it.
GS Tranny with a KJ:
Also- with all the extra pullies you would have to cut into the frame on the passenger side to make it fit.
It is a COMPLETELY differnet motor than the KL. Not worth it unless you had a Donor Millenia and a Donor MX-3 and lots of fabrication skillz.
well, yes, possible.
probable? no.
the GS tranny DOES bolt up to the KJ, however... in case you were wondering.
the halfshaft/jackshaft does not bolt to the KJ block- plus a whole host of other hassles.
not to mention the fact that you cant really get any more power out of the KJ than its already putting down. Only a few more than the KL.
For all the hassle - the KL is a much better option. Easy to bolt in and lots of parts for it.
GS Tranny with a KJ:
Also- with all the extra pullies you would have to cut into the frame on the passenger side to make it fit.
It is a COMPLETELY differnet motor than the KL. Not worth it unless you had a Donor Millenia and a Donor MX-3 and lots of fabrication skillz.
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 1:22 am
WTF is a 4-cyl guy doing posting in the v6 section! GTFO!
I also meant to add, its been discussed here A LOT. Do some searching & you will see.
I also meant to add, its been discussed here A LOT. Do some searching & you will see.
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 1:34 am
Maybe
No one has attempted it, but people have tried a few things. 2 major things I believe were an issue, hood clearance and transmission. The Millenia only came as auto, so there's been speculation about bolting up a manual gearbox, and as of several months ago I believe, it was dry fitted and it does bolt up, with the exception of one bolt. But taht's pretty much to the excent that has been tried.
The 2.3L KJ-ZEM is a motor that is designed not for performance (unlike the KL's) but for effencienty. Remember, the Millenia is not a sport car by any means. It's Miller-Cycle design is based around the function of the supercharger. It give the power output of a 3.0L, with the fuel economy of a 2.0L. I've heard that it's not quite reliable, and it's design is a pain to work on. As well, as compared to the KL's which are pentiful, the KJ is only available in the Millenia S, thus, parts will be much more scarse, and expensive. And the KJ uses a different wiring harness (probaly OBDII), using a MAF system, so it would not be plug and play like the KL's are into our cars, as well, it's unknown how the motor will react to not having an auto transmission, or even the auto tranny ECU.
There's alot of quesitons that haven't been answered in regards to the KJ swap, but it's really overly complication a power upgrade when theirs a much, much easier and and better (with the exception of the minute sacrifice in power) alternative to go KL. In the end, it's probably just more hassle than it's worth, and I don't believe any aftermarket exists for the KJ.Not sure on total cost in attempting it, but people have modded their KLZE's to get close to 200whp, so in terms of crank HP, you should be able to get something simular for output. Even then, KL turbo kits are becoming more popular. With just a few PSI, you can easilly get more power than a KJ.
ALot of people would like to see the swap totally attempted once just to know, but that's about it, it'll be more of a curiosity thing if anything really.
No one has attempted it, but people have tried a few things. 2 major things I believe were an issue, hood clearance and transmission. The Millenia only came as auto, so there's been speculation about bolting up a manual gearbox, and as of several months ago I believe, it was dry fitted and it does bolt up, with the exception of one bolt. But taht's pretty much to the excent that has been tried.
The 2.3L KJ-ZEM is a motor that is designed not for performance (unlike the KL's) but for effencienty. Remember, the Millenia is not a sport car by any means. It's Miller-Cycle design is based around the function of the supercharger. It give the power output of a 3.0L, with the fuel economy of a 2.0L. I've heard that it's not quite reliable, and it's design is a pain to work on. As well, as compared to the KL's which are pentiful, the KJ is only available in the Millenia S, thus, parts will be much more scarse, and expensive. And the KJ uses a different wiring harness (probaly OBDII), using a MAF system, so it would not be plug and play like the KL's are into our cars, as well, it's unknown how the motor will react to not having an auto transmission, or even the auto tranny ECU.
There's alot of quesitons that haven't been answered in regards to the KJ swap, but it's really overly complication a power upgrade when theirs a much, much easier and and better (with the exception of the minute sacrifice in power) alternative to go KL. In the end, it's probably just more hassle than it's worth, and I don't believe any aftermarket exists for the KJ.Not sure on total cost in attempting it, but people have modded their KLZE's to get close to 200whp, so in terms of crank HP, you should be able to get something simular for output. Even then, KL turbo kits are becoming more popular. With just a few PSI, you can easilly get more power than a KJ.
ALot of people would like to see the swap totally attempted once just to know, but that's about it, it'll be more of a curiosity thing if anything really.
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 2:19 am
A PAIN to work on is an understantement. With all that Super Charger crap it is a rats nest on top of a spider web on top of a junk pile of metal. The vaccum is a nightmare, the super charger pipes are all over the place and the wiring is inconcievable. You have to remove the parts in a very specific order to get at anything and the parts you have to remove to get at wear type parts are plentiful and complicated. I'd stick with a KL ANY day after taking a serious look at the KJ swap. Trust us, MOCA had a 500 dollar KJ Millinea completely intact, free G series V6 trans that bolted up and a 300 dollar complete MX-3 donor to fit it into. It wasn't even worth going past measuring things for initial clearance. If it was tought we would have given it a go just as a Thrusday nights project, but it would have been easier to make a some sort of KL bolt-ons that would add more HP.
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 11:35 am
WTF- I posted pics of us bolting the tranny up to it just right above your post...Nd4SpdSe wrote:The Millenia only came as auto, so there's been speculation about bolting up a manual gearbox
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 4:16 pm
Ya, there was no replies when i started my post, it was late and i didn't feel like correcting it, but even then, it may bolt up, but you stil dont know if it'll work properly, and as you mentioned, the halfshaft/jackshaft does not bolt to the KJ block...atlantamx3 wrote:WTF- I posted pics of us bolting the tranny up to it just right above your post...Nd4SpdSe wrote:The Millenia only came as auto, so there's been speculation about bolting up a manual gearbox
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 6:36 pm
yeah your post was pretty long! LOL
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 6:37 pm
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 6:46 pm
The half shaft is close, but not perfect. It could be modified to work. As for the axles, when you put the motor in the MX frame it will need atleast one, possibly two custom mounts. With that, you could adjust the motor position to get the axle alignment correct. Also, with two of the mounts being on the V6 G series trans you know the drivers side will work since the trans is in the same spot. Shifter linkage would be fine too since the trans hasn't moved. Wiring and ECU are easy enough since it would all come from the engine harness of the Millinea. Guages might or might not work, we didn't go that far. The brake booster and master clylinder might be an issue since they are incredibly close on the KL and the KJ is larger on the top side and you obviosly cannot swap intakes.
So basically box the frame so the KJ pullies will fit, make a ram air or shaker hood to hold the SC, swap the tranny and hope the axles line up, fab some engine mounts for the passanger side, hope the guages will work well enough.
So basically box the frame so the KJ pullies will fit, make a ram air or shaker hood to hold the SC, swap the tranny and hope the axles line up, fab some engine mounts for the passanger side, hope the guages will work well enough.
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 9:44 pm
Hmm, that's kinda cool actually.
One thing, I know it's been asked about the KJ supercharger, but what makes it different that it can't bolt onto the head of the other k-series?
One thing, I know it's been asked about the KJ supercharger, but what makes it different that it can't bolt onto the head of the other k-series?
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 10:19 pm
The heads of the KJ are much farther apart, which let the Supercharger sit down between them- as you can see in this pic:
not to mention all the intercooler tubing that is a damn mess.
Here are more pics of just how BIG the motor and all the accesories are.
Notice the location of the throttle body?
And just one of the intercooler pipes & intercooler:
not going to work, fellas.
not to mention all the intercooler tubing that is a damn mess.
Here are more pics of just how BIG the motor and all the accesories are.
Notice the location of the throttle body?
And just one of the intercooler pipes & intercooler:
not going to work, fellas.
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 10:24 pm
Wow that's a funky engine!
(right-click, save-as)
(right-click, save-as)
Posted: January 15th, 2007, 10:36 pm
just to show the size difference....
