Dead ZE - Need advice on what to do. - COMPRESSION RESULTS

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 17th, 2005, 8:27 pm

I only used this CT to do my compression test. The loosers who said my gasket was shot were from a no-name garage.

ScooterBovine · Post by **ScooterBovine** » August 17th, 2005, 11:31 pm

I just paid $600 today to get my water pump fixed. I pegged red when my car overheated, and when it does, your engine light comes on and your car runs all sort of weird. I let the car sit the night before, and when I woke up to take it to the shop, there was a nice pool of liquid under my car on the passenger side, right near under the timing belt.

By the way, when they go to replace the water pump, you might as well as replace the timing belt, too. Never hurts to do preventive stuff like that!

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 18th, 2005, 12:17 am

$600??

My garage quoted me 250-300 CDN. Will let you know the full bill tomorrow.

Was thinking of doing the belt too. Will see how much extra they charge.

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » August 18th, 2005, 1:56 am

Overclock wrote:$600??
My garage quoted me 250-300 CDN. Will let you know the full bill tomorrow.
Was thinking of doing the belt too. Will see how much extra they charge.

Oh ya, big savings to get it done now. Do you know the actual mileage on the current timing belt? Better, not to piss around onthis sort of thing. I've something similar and changed timing belt up tp 20k before it was actually due because of other work being done. Ya, it's not something that was financially planned for but it'll eliminate that grey area of uncertainty for the future and possibibly prevent circumstances similar to what you have just experienced. I'm sure you don't want to go through this sort of "what if" dance all over again if it happens to be timing belt issues. Hey, while they are at it might as well replace the other belts since they're pretty cheap anyways and you'll be starting fresh from ground zero. It's something I did fairly recently with my Protege' when some servicing issues were in question or in doubt and I wasn't about to take any chances. I now have peace of mind that the likelihood of a major failure is highly unlikely.

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 18th, 2005, 6:16 pm

OK, so I had the work done. Now instead of the check engine light being eternally on, it's constantly blinking. Also, there seems to be more shaking than usual. The fans on the radiator in specific are shaking quite a bit. Also, the high idle hasn't stopped either.
Getting a little tired of dumping so much money in this car. Now I have to pay to get the error codes off the ECU....

I told the mechanic that it's an MX-6 engine so he might have put an MX-6 pump. Is it possible that it's more powerful than the MX-3 pump and it's causing abnormally high pressure in the MX-3 rad?

Zoso124 · Post by **Zoso124** » August 18th, 2005, 6:19 pm

No, same exact pump, that was pretty quick. How come they let it leave without fixing all the bugs?

Tunes67 · Post by **Tunes67** » August 18th, 2005, 6:28 pm

No offense man.. but obviously you are not a "Tuner" and your not really into it.. what you apparently want is a reliable daily driver that you dont have to hassle with. What you need to do is hook up with someone that knows how to troubleshoot a KLZE swap into a MX-3. I am not intending to be mean or rude here.. but you are in over your head with this car and by stating:

Getting a little tired of dumping so much money in this car.

Apparently you had no idea what you were buying to begin with.. maybe you can find someone on this board that would be willing to swap their stock MX-3 for your Modded one. Otherwise.. prepare to keep spending cash since you lack the education or ability to troubleshoot this yourself. You can clear the ECU codes by disconnecting the battery for 10 minutes and pump the brake pedal a few times while the battery is disconnected. See if that doesnt resolve the flashing CEL. Your idle issue can be attributed to a number of things from something as simple as a screwdriver adjustment to a bad IAC valve. Again.. if you are unable to do this stuff yourself.. and you dont have anyone nearby that can help you.. Then maybe you should sell the car and buy a stock MX-3. When you convert a car into something it didnt come from the factory as.. you are going to have hiccups that need to be resolved. Your only other option is to keep paying shops to do this stuff for you. Best of luck

Tunes67

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 18th, 2005, 6:29 pm

Because they're a crap garage. I only use them to do jobs when I know what the problem is because they have no troubleshooting skills whatsoever.

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 19th, 2005, 1:16 am

Tunes, you've helped me quite a bit so far so I won't take offense by what you're saying however your conclusions are somewhat premature.

First off, even if I had the know-how or the time to do the labour for all the repairs my car has needed, the bill for parts alone would still be high. Yes I want a reliable car, but who doesn't? Without knowing the history of parts I've had to change in the past few months, I don't see how you feel justified to judge whether or not I can complain about the money going into this vehicle.

Simply passing off the buck by stating I should sell the car and labeling me as "not a Tuner" really defeats the purpose of this message board and I'm not quite sure why you're doing it now after you've been so helpful in the past. I'm still very much into my car otherwise I would have sold it ages ago. Take it easy and let me gripe a little at my bank account getting depleted. I understand a modded car is bound to have it's hiccups; one of the reasons I bought it was to learn about mechanics and have something fun to drive in the process.

Now, as for the CEL business. I'm aware of how to clear the codes. The matter of it being a solid CEL and now it's constantly flashing theoretically indicates that it found something different. The last time I had it flashing was when the spark plug wire for cyl #1 broke during the compression test earlier this week and it wasn't firing at all. When we changed the plug wire, the CEL went back to solid. So, I surmise something new is wrong since it's now flashing after the water pump + timing belt change. Does anyone know if a flashing CEL for OBD2 indicates a more urgent problem?

For the idle issue... this began only when it overheated. It idled at 600 RPM's beforehand. Seems indicative of something having damaged in the process of the overheat but any thoughts on alternative theories would be appreciated. If the TB screw adjustment was fine before the overheat and nobody has touched it since, shouldn't it still be correctly adjusted? Maybe the metal expanded from the extreme temp of the overheat and offset the idle screw?

Thanks again

ScooterBovine · Post by **ScooterBovine** » August 19th, 2005, 5:14 am

Overclock wrote:Now I have to pay to get the error codes off the ECU....

What do you mean by this? Do you mean make it so the CEL doesn't come on, or do you want the codes themselves so you can see the problems? If I'm not mistaken, don't you jumper the TEN and GND or something and it flashes the codes for you? I don't think you need to pay someone for that...

Of course, I may just be talking out my butt and not have a clue as to what I am talking about.

I was told if you overheat the car too much, you can "warp the heads"... Dunno what this means, exactly, but maybe something like this happened?

On my old MX-3, the idle used to go wacky all the time, for no reason. Normally, the screw just rattled a little loose or something, and I would readjust it, and no more problems. Just because no one has touched it doesn't mean something didn't happen to it...

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 19th, 2005, 7:36 am

Well, here's another factor to the new idle problem. The car will still idle at 600 rpm's on a cold start but only on a cold start and without it having been driven anywhere yet.

Tried the jumper trick to get the error codes and it doesn't seem to work for OBD2. It was done by a buddy of mine who's done tons of work on OBDI MX-3's so he knew what he was doing too.

Tunes67 · Post by **Tunes67** » August 19th, 2005, 12:30 pm

I applaud your desire to learn how to work on your ride man.. But you sure picked a tough car to cut your teeth on

As for your idle issue.. well that could be a couple of things.. you are correct in that the idle adjustment screw position wont have changed.. but.. when you overheat an engine.. especially one that has aluminum heads.. well.. things can get a bit tricky. You could check your IAC valve.. its located in your Throttle Body. You would need to remove the TB and clean it up well. I did a write up on how to do a clean up and adjust on your TB.. but its for the DOHC 4 cyl engine.. same priciples apply though.. you can find it in the 4cyl FAQ area. But probably the first thing I would check would be the grommet where your PCV Valve plugs into your valve cover.. meaning.. it sounds like you have a vacuum leak somewhere. Make sure all your hose connections are tight. If you are using the stock ribbed intake hose & air box.. make sure those are sealed and not cracked as well.

Now as far as the CEL codes go.. The reason that I suggested clearing the codes is to make sure that whatever code you have picked up is not some kind of false code. Sometimes after major repairs are done.. it takes a little bit of time running the engine before proper coolant and oil flow get back to normal and fill all of the little passages they are supposed to. Especially after replacing something like your water pump. You may have picked up coolant temp sensor warnings or something like that, that once the engine has run for a bit would normally go away.. but if you dont clear your ECU.. they wont go away

I apologize for getting on your case a bit.. I was just a bit frustrated that after the successes you have had so far with your troubleshooting.. that you were "getting tired of dumping money into the car" Which to me.. made it sound like all this work is for nothing and that you were thinking of dumping the car anyway. Which would have made the time I have personally spent trying to help you.. a complete waste.

Scooter.. You are correct.. if you overheat an engine with Aluminum (or cast iron even) heads.. you can warp the heads. If you want to see what "Warping" looks like.. throw a Jolly Rancher stick candy onto a hot BBQ.

However.. Unless this results in blowing a head gasket.. usually the effect is minimal and not something to worry about offhand. It can make the head more difficult to machine and rebuild down the road however.

Best of Luck

Tunes67

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 20th, 2005, 3:29 pm

Tunes, you're the man.

IM vacuum hose fell out somehow. Idle is now back down to 600. Have to buy a clamp to make sure it stays put.

Also cleared the CEL codes and the check engine didn't light up after I drove it for a couple of km's. We'll see how that pans out after I drive it to work next week.

Noticed something though... between turning the car on and off this morning I saw the coolant hoses from the left and right sides of the engine were sucked in from the pressure in the coolant system. Is that normal? I'm concerned the garage I had the work done at might not have filled the tank enough.
They did expand after I ran the engine at high RPMS for a few minutes so there's definitly coolant flowing in there.

Overclock · Post by **Overclock** » August 21st, 2005, 12:12 am

... had to go visit family tonight... solid check engine light came on during the trip in and then it began flashing the entire ride home.

Almost positive the flashing one is originating from the cooling system. The rad fan didn't want to turn off when I parked my car and left the engine idle for a while. I know it's supposed to turn on from lack of creating enough wind while driving but it normally turns off after a bit.

Anyway, think I'll go to CT tomorrow to buy an OBD2 code reader and just return it when I've pulled the codes.

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » August 21st, 2005, 1:27 am

pm sent