vaf?

David Coleman · Post by **David Coleman** » September 5th, 2002, 1:59 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by curtklze: Really? what dose the MAF measure? water flow? and the VAF measures what? oil flow?I thought that they were both used to measure the amount of air that is going in to the combustion chamber, but they just do it differently. well I guess I was wrong

Its always good to read the post and under stand it before you try to disprove it.Again, They all do the same basic thing, they just do it in a different way.One guy could kick you in the a-- with a steel toed boot and another guy could kick you in the a-- with a a running shoe, in the end you still get kicked in the a--.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Dude, VAF's and MAF's are totally different. Maybe you should read Mike's page before you try to tell him that they're the same thing. <A HREF="http://home.golden.net/~trinity/massair/massair.htm" TARGET=_blank>http://home.golden.net/~trinity/massair/massair.htm</A> Also try andrew brownsword's page which is linked in my sig. <A HREF="http://www.brownsword.ca" TARGET=_blank>www.brownsword.ca</A>

Mike 94PGT · Post by **Mike 94PGT** » September 5th, 2002, 4:53 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by curtklze: Really? what dose the MAF measure? water flow? and the VAF measures what? oil flow? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Think about it: mass and volume are two different properties of a gas and cannot be considered directly interchangeable. Mass is a measure of the amount of material entering the engine and volume is a measure of the space taken up by that material. An engine control system generally ultimately calculates fuel/air ratios by mass. A MAF tells the computer directly what mass of air is entering the engine. A VAF tells the PCM what volume of air is being ingested. By using the barometric pressure (as read by the BARO sensor), the intake air temperature sensor (as read by the IAT sensor) and a few other minor corrective terms and constants, the PCM can calculate the mass of air from the constants, corrective terms, volume, baro and temperature terms. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>I thought that they were both used to measure the amount of air that is going in to the combustion chamber, but they just do it differently. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>What you said was "They all measuer the Mass of the air entering the engine, they just do it in different ways." They do not both measure mass. One measures the mass (MAF), the other measures the volume (VAF). For this reason one cannot simply substitute a MAF in place of a VAF without some computational brains between the MAF and VAF-PCM or PCM changes directly. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Its always good to read the post and under stand it before you try to disprove it.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>And it's always better to state your arguments clearly. You stated clearly they both measure mass and they do not. They measure airflow, yes, but they do not both measure mass. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>One guy could kick you in the a-- with a steel toed boot and another guy could kick you in the a-- with a a running shoe, in the end you still get kicked in the a--.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>A rather poor analogy: sure, both kinds of footwear can dent a door or bruise a cheek but both kinds of sensors are not interchangeable for the tasks they perform. I suggest you try bolting on a Cobra MAF directly to your car and have the car tell you the two sensors are not measuring the same thing...Anyway, perhaps it's semantics but I felt the distinction needed to be clarified in light of the errors stated here.[ September 05, 2002: Message edited by: Mike 94PGT ]

Mike 94PGT · Post by **Mike 94PGT** » September 5th, 2002, 5:05 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by David Coleman: The 1993 Mazda MX-3 Shop manual refers to it as an Air Flow Meter, or AFM.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>For reference, mx-3.com's own on-line service manual calls it a volume air flow sensor. See pages F2-10, -13, -74, -80, -95 and there are probably more...

David Coleman · Post by **David Coleman** » September 6th, 2002, 2:51 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Mike 94PGT: For reference, mx-3.com's own on-line service manual calls it a volume air flow sensor. See pages F2-10, -13, -74, -80, -95 and there are probably more...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yeah, that's one of the updates in the 95 manual, which is the version that is online on MX-3.com. Good to have you around Mike

curtklze · Post by **curtklze** » September 6th, 2002, 12:09 pm

please read the hole post. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by curtklze: They all measuer the Mass of the air entering the engine, they just do it in different ways..<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>See how I said they do it in different ways

and then I went on to explain. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by curtklze: The VAF on the 1.8l v6 measures the both the volume of air and the temp of the air. the computer then can calculate the mass of the air entering the engine using the 2 readings and give it the right ammout of fuel.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I am a mechanic, and a Canadian one at that, that means I have more than a wrench and 2 dollar ASE patch on my arm . I have to be certified by at least the province that I work in, and if your good enough you can be certified to work any where in canada, I am. when explaining things to people that dont know much about cars" what is a VAF and dose my car have one?" its best to try to keep things simple. Ive had 8 years to find out that going in depth on the way certian sensors and and other complex components work wont usually be rememberd by the customer and that they still wont under stand how it works.I also take care to make sure my posts are fairly accurate(except for spelling

)but many people miss read them and start to argue with me over nothing.It may be that I make my posts unclear or confusing, if I do im sorry

, but when I re-read them it looks like every thing I said was right, and I will say again read all of the post and under stand it befor you pick the fly ---- out of the pepper.

[ September 06, 2002: Message edited by: Custommx3 ]

Mike 94PGT · Post by **Mike 94PGT** » September 6th, 2002, 7:57 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by curtklze: please read the hole post. I am a mechanic, and a Canadian one at that, that means I have more than a wrench and 2 dollar ASE patch on my arm . I have to be certified by at least the province that I work in, and if your good enough you can be certified to work any where in canada, I am. when explaining things to people that dont know much about cars" what is a VAF and dose my car have one?" its best to try to keep things simple. Ive had 8 years to find out that going in depth on the way certian sensors and and other complex components work wont usually be rememberd by the customer and that they still wont under stand how it works.I also take care to make sure my posts are fairly accurate(except for spelling

)but many people miss read them and start to argue with me over nothing.It may be that I make my posts unclear or confusing, if I do im sorry

If something is in error, I'll do my best to correct it. Posting dumbed-down, "simplified" information helps no one. Stick to posting the correct information clearly (good spelling & grammar helps in the clarity department but is not mandatory as we all make typos now and then...). If someone doesn't understand what you post, they'll ask you for a follow-up.[ September 06, 2002: Message edited by: Custommx3 ]

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