Different flavor of rice.....

[Josh]

Edit: none related content.

[MrMazda92]

MX-3s can't tow a 30 foot boat, so is a Diesel truck better than an MX-3?
That same truck won't touch a stock MX-3 for fuel economy or handling, so is the MX-3 better than the truck?

um sure it could. My AWD MX with the boosted motor could. Hell with the B6 I had more TQ and HP than a standard ford or chevey pickup. Now I may not have the pulling gears or the weight behind the car but I could based on numbers, stopping might take a mile but I could. As for the mileage of the truck, My dads 96' F350 Diesel gets 22mph towing, My brothers new Chevey gets closer to 28 mpg going down the freeway and will blow the doors off of my MX-3 ZE in the quarter mile.

Now we are getting off topic here. To each their own, do what makes you happy and F*** everyone else.

I think the Kia is Bad @$$. That is a DD I would drive around just to piss people off

Did I even remotely mention horsepower or torque? A heavy vehicle with little of either can tow a boat. Try towing anything heavier than 1 ton up a hill with an MX-3. Post videos...

Why do people only associate "fast" with a straight line? Jesus, how many of us care if our cars handle well?

You can make anything fast in a straight line... Also, notice I specifically stated stock cars in my earlier post.

Cars don't typically tow boats, so they're "bad" at towing. Trucks typically aren't designed with cornering in mind, so they typically have lackluster handling.

The vehicle is designed for something(or built, aftermarket) for something else. That makes it good at that specific task. Trucks -> Towing, Cars -> Handling, boats -> floating. To avoid any more "well, there was this one guy one time who built a xxxxxxx to do xxxxxxx" responses, I'll repeat: This is a generalized statement, regarding STOCK cars.

You can make anything do anything, given enough time and effort... Can we get back to "rice" as the topic now?

[Josh]

Edit: none related content.

[MrMazda92]

Once again Josh, you failed to read even half of my post, and then argued with half truths and combinations of stock/highly modified vehicles to further support your point(while mine was 100% based on stock vehicles).

Your AWD MX-3 isn't stock. I figured you of all people would know that... Here's a simplified reiteration of my previous post:

STOCK COMPARISON
Was the MX-3 built to tow?

Were your dad's/brother's trucks built as an entry level, economical "sport-coupe", designed to attract young drivers to the Mazda brand?

Which tows better, a stock truck(Let's use your example of Ford/Chevy models, of the same vintage) or a stock MX-3?

Which gets better fuel economy, and is more attractive to young early '90s drivers? The stock MX-3, or the stock truck?

Now, in reference to the stream of google copypasta you posted... Show me one single video of a STOCK car towing anything equal or heavier in weight up or down a slope greater than 20 degrees.

We all know that anything can be modified to do anything, but I'm grateful for the reminder. That being said, cars weren't designed with towing in mind, and trucks weren't designed with handling/fuel economy in mind.

You can throw out electric converted trucks, "cruck" towing vehicles, and any other highly modified vehicles, as I have said a whopping 3 times now, as they were not mass produced for those purposes.

Trying to use a rare aftermarket conversion to support your argument is beneath you Josh, you're smarter than that. I KNOW you are, because you're one of the most intelligent and most dedicated members on this forum. While I tend to agree with you in general, you're trying to argue something that we both already agree on.

I concede that a highly modified vehicle can do anything you build it to do, but that won't change the manufacturer's intended purpose(or the vehicle's stock capabilities).

[MrMazda92]

Short answer, this complete statement is wrong, and that was my point. Why, it is possible for a MX3 to tow a 30 boat, you did not give specifics. A Diesel truck is better than a stock MX3 depending on what truck it is. As for fuel economy you are wrong again. The average GS only gets about 22-28 mpg, and as far as handling is concerned, well go test drive a new truck you might be surprised.

Do I need to give specifics? This'll blow your mind.

Here's your entire post, blown to hell by your own statement:

The standard hitch for the MX3 has a 700 lb tongue weigh and a 2000 lb rolling weight. you are limited by the chassis but that can be fixed with a different type of hitch, as well as a trailer that has it's own braking system.

Now, re-read the multiple repeated statements(by me) in my posts about stock vs. stock.

Every. Single. Post. throughout this "discussion" specifically mentioned stock vehicles.

Those are original, never before edited(as you yourself can read, if you so desire) posts by me.

Edit:

"MX-3s can't tow a 30 foot boat, so is a Diesel truck better than an MX-3?
That same truck won't touch a stock MX-3 for fuel economy or handling, so is the MX-3 better than the truck?"

Short answer, this complete statement is wrong, and that was my point. Why, it is possible for a MX3 to tow a 30 boat, you did not give specifics.

Please, show me one massively produced 30+ foot boat/trailer combination that weighs under 2000 pounds.

A Diesel truck is better than a stock MX3 depending on what truck it is. As for fuel economy you are wrong again. The average GS only gets about 22-28 mpg, and as far as handling is concerned, well go test drive a new truck you might be surprised.

I have recorded 30+ MPG city over the past 3 years on a regular basis, with a 100% factory GS. Stock K8, exhaust rusted to hell, no front lip, stock ride height, and stock wheels/tires at correct pressure.
I drove a diesel truck as a delivery driver for 14 months, and averaged 24 city. It was a 2000 series Ford. I was the most efficient of the 3 drivers that drove it regularly.

/argument

[Josh]

Edit: none related content.

[RobMinhas]

Looks kind of strange without the big spoiler and I feel like it definitely makes the car look nicer, don't think it's ricey at all.

The only time I found spoilers to be ricey are when there are large ones like this:



On FWD cars, especially if it doesn't flow with the body. Of course they are some exceptions but I'm just generally not a fan.

[Savin]

Rob, that's just a normal WRX with the low-pro spoiler. But you're right it does look strange without the shopping cart handle. It just has to have it!

[MrMazda92]

Good Job! You deserve a medal, it probably took you 10 times as long to "blow" my post as it took me to type it out, which was all of about 1 minute.

I am not going to bicker in this thread. My post is not blown to hell, you sir, in the politest way I can say it, are a complete buffoon. Here is your boat, yes it is a boat they are mass produced, thus meeting your criteria. I work with two companies that build them and sell them world wide, and they can be up to 60' long. I am not going to dignify you with a video example as you are perfectly capable of searching YT yourself.



I am not going to call you out in public, as you seem to like to think you try and do to others. I will make it simple, just add me to your foe list it will make life a lot easier here on the forum going forward.

I'd bet good money I spent less time writing and quoting than you did googling those photos. I didn't have to research and "find" evidence to substantiate my claims... My family have been Shock, Laser(Vanguard), Capri, etc. reps for over 20 years(Selling mostly any sailbotboat up to and including 40 footers produced/sold in the U.S.).

As it happens, a 700 pound boat typically rolls out with a trailer equal or exceeding that weight. These are ~20-24 foot sailboats, which are far lighter than the average speed or fishing boat(of equal size). I've weighed and measured prior to national regattas for more than a decade, totalling in the hundreds... Add 5' to the length, add 200 pounds give or take.

I might add that I've put over 1/4 million miles into towing these(and many other) boats, and aside from Kansas, you won't find anybody towing a large trailer with their car.

I'm sorry to burst your bubble Josh, but there are topics where I would defer to you in an instant, this just doesn't happen to be one of them.

Btw, a competition grade boat for team rowing, towed by a vehicle lacking the capacity to carry it's entire crew? The one example google offered you was pretty lame.

Edit:
FWIW, I've personally towed a Lido 14(roughly 550 pounds including the trailer, sails, full rigging) behind an AWD Subaru. I wouldn't recommend it with anything over 1,000 pounds, as even the slightest hill can pose a problem in fair weather. Again, this is personal experience I am basing my statements on.

You can call me names all you like, but it won't change the fact that towing a large(i.e. heavy, unwieldy) trailer behind a small car is not a smart move. I harbor no ill will for you Josh, but I won't lie to you and say that you are correct, I'd rather be honest and shunned than dishonest and popular.

The friends that matter don't care if you're wrong or right, they're friends for the right reasons. If disagreeing with you is enough reason for you to harbor ill will towards me, then so be it. I still admire your contributions to the forums, and respect your knowledge in regards to these cars.

[Custommx3]

Just because you can do something doesnt mean you should..

[kulluminati777]

Yeah the low profile wing for the STI is not very nice oem or not

But the trend here in cali is to completly remove the high rise wing and this spoiler and go "bareback" lol but in my opinion thats "ricey" as weird as that sounds

Those cars (evo's,STI's) dont look right at all with nothing on the rear. I think it robs the "sporty" look off the car and although it is a beast non the less the car looks like something a mom would drive....

[MrMazda92]

Just because you can do something doesnt mean you should..

I agree with this 100%!

A long time ago, when I was new to towing, I made the mistake of towing a 20' boat(trailer, boat, rigging combined 1,800 pounds) with a bumper mounted hitch. I knew it was a risky decision, but my regular tow vehicle wasn't running and I already had $400 invested into the event.

By the end of the trip the bumper was sagging about 2" lower than it should have been. It made the trip safely, but it sure as hell wasn't the wise move! I've gone with my better judgement ever since, and had no problems since then.

[MrMazda92]

Yeah the low profile wing for the STI is not very nice oem or not

But the trend here in cali is to completly remove the high rise wing and this spoiler and go "bareback" lol but in my opinion thats "ricey" as weird as that sounds

Those cars (evo's,STI's) dont look right at all with nothing on the rear. I think it robs the "sporty" look off the car and although it is a beast non the less the car looks like something a mom would drive....

You know, I do agree that they look funny with no spoiler. I kind of feel the same way about the late 90s Toyota Camry, after seeing the optional factory spoiler on a few around town. I would feel weird trying to add one to mine, but it does make the trunk look more natural on the car.

[Nd4SpdSe]

In my Mx-3's manual, as well as the 626, the manual specifies that no mazda car is designed for towing.

[Surgeonasst222]

Yeah the low profile wing for the STI is not very nice oem or not

But the trend here in cali is to completly remove the high rise wing and this spoiler and go "bareback" lol but in my opinion thats "ricey" as weird as that sounds

Those cars (evo's,STI's) dont look right at all with nothing on the rear. I think it robs the "sporty" look off the car and although it is a beast non the less the car looks like something a mom would drive....

I agree.,.

My buddy had a evo without anything on the rear and it looks horrible, he also can't seem to sell it for this reason lol

But each there own