Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

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dexxin
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Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by dexxin »

Hey guys, first post here. I am REALLY interested in putting a nitrous kit in my car. I recently found a reliable car guy (who is about to work on my exhaust) and he suggested I put a NOS kit in my car just for the hell of it. Of course, being 16 and having nothing else to spend my money on, I have almost completely decided I will get this kit. Even though the price doesn't matter, he said it would run me $850 for a NOS brand kit (I think it may be the Sniper kit; I know the bottle he showed me to prove I would have space in my hatch was the Sniper) WITH a remote on/off switch for the bottle. He told me it would be a 50 shot dry kit and add about 11-15hp per cylinder when engaged (66-90hp). Also, I would use a Microswitch to trigger my nitrous instead of it going off at a set RPM so there is no flooding during deceleration. All this means is that the nitrous would begin to spray ONLY when my foot is pressed fully down on the gas pedal and once I pull off, no more nitrous enters. He only mentioned two switches to me, the bottle on/off and the nitrous arm switch, but after more research, I saw that a lot of people have "purge gauge switches." So here is where I will stop talking, state what I currently have, and ask a few questions that hopefully I can get some help with.

ONE LAST THING: I currently have a Flowtech Afterburner muffler (offset) on my car. Before I do NOS, the same guy is going to do my catback exhaust (move from 2" to 2.5") and put a direct flow Magnaflow muffler on.

1994 Mazda MX-3 GS
194,XXX on car (many, many replaced parts)
3X,XXX on engine DOHC 1.8l V6 :(
Flowtech Afterburner muffler (used adapters to install)
Weapon-R Short Ram Air Intake (professionally installed)
5-speed
2" stock exhaust pipes
(this may matter for wiring the switches) 1 Rockford Fosgate Punch 300w amp powering 2 6.5" MB Quart door speakers
1 Kenwood KAC-929 Bridgable amp powering 2 MTX Road Thunder subs
And you all know the rest of the stock GS stuff...

So here come the questions...

Is my car in good enough shape to put a 50 shot dry kit on? If so, is 50 shot as high as I should go, or should I get 75 (dry or wet)?
What does "50 shot" mean anyways?
If you say no to the first question, what is your reason? What could I do to put it in performance for nitrous?
Is a switch to purge the line that feeds the nitrous necessary? Are they usually included and my guy maybe just skipped over it?
Is a gauge that reads the nitrous pressure necessary?
Will this kit make me FLY?

I know that this was A LOT to read, but if you read all of it, I really appreciate it. All feedback is taken into consideration and GREATLY appreciated. Hope to hear from some of you guys soon.

Sam
'94 Blaze Red GS w/ minimal mods (under construction (; )
'03 Volkswagen GTI 1.8T (DD) Shaved airbox, 2.25" catback exhaust. Alpine IDA-X100 head unit, 1000w Kenwood Monoblock amp @ 1 ohm, 12" Kenwood sub in ported box
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Ryan
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by Ryan »

First off, Kudos for being 16 and not a douche bag.

Second, you realize nitrous is not legal for a street vehicle?

Third, you know you are stupid for wanting to use nitrous on the street?

Fourth, we always suggest wet kits.

Fifth, have you heard of the KLZE? That would cost you around $700-1000 and give you a reliable and constant 70hp upgrade.

Sixth, as I understand it, larger exhaust with nitrous won't give you any gains. Not noticeable, I'd think. You wouldn't want to go more than 2.25 for the 1.8 or even 2.5, unless you're boosting or love to drive at 7k.

Seventh, "50 shot" or "100 shot" refers to the supposed WHP gained with the nitrous.
Now with Moderator power!

Black '93 BP RS - wrecked, parted, scrapped.
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dexxin
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by dexxin »

Ryan wrote:First off, Kudos for being 16 and not a douche bag.

Second, you realize nitrous is not legal for a street vehicle?

Third, you know you are stupid for wanting to use nitrous on the street?

Fourth, we always suggest wet kits.

Fifth, have you heard of the KLZE? That would cost you around $700-1000 and give you a reliable and constant 70hp upgrade.

Sixth, as I understand it, larger exhaust with nitrous won't give you any gains. Not noticeable, I'd think. You wouldn't want to go more than 2.25 for the 1.8 or even 2.5, unless you're boosting or love to drive at 7k.

Seventh, "50 shot" or "100 shot" refers to the supposed WHP gained with the nitrous.

Ryan,

I guess I should start off by thanking you for a) replying to my post and b) realizing I am not a douchebag. I do have responses to what you have said though (in a totally non-douchebaggy way).

From the glance at your post count, name, etc... I noticed you are not from the United States (unless I read incorrectly, sorry). In the US it actually is completely legal to have nitrous in your car as long as the hose is "disconnected from the bottle." If you interpret this correctly, it basically means don't go blasting around town using nitrous. I will now merge your third point into this paragraph while still addressing the second. Of course, if you were using nitrous on the street and you got caught, there is a possibility you could get away with it (who knows, I've never had NOS in my car and been caught, plus, I am hiding my tank and my switches), but yes, you, as in the person doing the act, are "stupid" for using nitrous on the street. In my original post, I do believe that I never stated where I would be using the nitrous kit, so it really isn't fair to call me "stupid" for assuming that I would be doing something that stupid, haha. If I must justify myself for you, I want to put a nitrous kit in my car so I can start going out to the local drag strip (which is a certified NHRA track) and do some quarter mile runs in tournaments and maybe some bracket racing (even if the nitrous could make bracket racing more difficult, I don't have to use it).

Alright, got it about the wet kits. After I posted, I did some more thorough reading and read up and the general consensus is that wet kits have taken over. But can I still use a Microswitch with a wet kit?

Yes, I am ever so aware of the KLZE. I would LOVE to put one in my car, but like you said, they are from $700-$1000 (I've seen them for up to $1500) and then having someone do the swap for me could cost up to $1000. I need some validation on this, but I was told that with the KLZE, you cannot use A/C. If this is true, it is completely out of the question for me; Texas is way too hot. I am also ASSUMING (please correct me if I am wrong) that the KLZE would decrease fuel economy; another big turn off. Finally, I would love to have a 70hp boost all the time, but to get that I could end up spending close or more than $2000. For less than half of that, I could have a system installed that gives me about the same amount of power whenever I need it. Even with all that said, I would die for a KLZE.

I didn't think that the exhaust would really play a role in the nitrous' job, but before I starting to even ponder nitrous, I had already allotted money for 2.5" catback exhaust and a new direct flow muffler. And why yes, I do enjoy tooling around town at 7,000 RPMs.

Lastly, thank you for clarifying the definition of "shot", and thank you for all of your feedback.


A question still sits in my mind though.... Purge Valve? A necessity? Enlighten me.
'94 Blaze Red GS w/ minimal mods (under construction (; )
'03 Volkswagen GTI 1.8T (DD) Shaved airbox, 2.25" catback exhaust. Alpine IDA-X100 head unit, 1000w Kenwood Monoblock amp @ 1 ohm, 12" Kenwood sub in ported box
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solo_ryder
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by solo_ryder »

Iirc purge valve is not needed for a wet kit, should be used on a dry system.

K8 will handle a 50 shot but you clutch might not.

Another point is your vris should be tied back so that you do not get unequal amounts of spray in random cylinders. Only issue with this is you would either have to tie it back all the time and have less normal power.. Or you would have to tie em back when only using nitrous. This is in reference to a dry kit.

A wet kit would be a better option, I would recommend getting a good fuel pressure regulator tho if you are gonna run a 50 shot wet on the k8, just so the air/fuel can keep up.

Overall for the cash I'd say get a KL, ud have all the power u need all the time. And ya whoever told u ac won't work on a KL is dumb. I'm using all my external parts (alty, disty, ac compressor) from my k8 and they all work fine. U can do the swap urself with abit of time and patience,
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h3xt0r
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by h3xt0r »

Aah! You remind me of myself a few years back :-).

If you don't mind my input; I would advise against using Nitrous in a stock K8 engine. I am of course 'assuming' that you're still running mostly stock. I believe the other guys when they say the K8 can handle it but I don't think the engine will last long regardless. Having played alot with Nitrous kits in the past I am pretty sure you'd (not so much you personally, but the engine itself.) burn up your internals pretty quick.

My suggestion if you want some good power is grab a KLDE for $300USD from Pick N Pull ( 93-97 MX-6/626/Probe, 95-02 Millenia) or if you can get one find a JSpec KLZE from an import shop for around $800-900USD. Both of these engines will add a good bit of power to your car.

Just my two cents. :-P
-H3xT0r
kateCapshaw wrote:The moment somebody says to me, "This is very risky," is the moment it becomes attractive to me.
dexxin
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by dexxin »

Solo and h3x,

Thank you so much for your input and helpful suggestions! I'm in Pick n Pull right now looking around a little bit, seeing what is in my area. The engine swap is not something I could do though.

h3x, you are right; I am still running mostly stock. Under the hood I do have a Short Ram Air Intake (which I love and had professionally installed) and I just got a brand new distributor (even though I don't think that would do anything:p). I know running the nitrous on the K8 is a bit ridiculous, but you only live once, and once I graduate from HS, the MX-3 is going into storage and I'm getting a Mazdaspeed 3. In all actuality, my engine is in very good condition, considering that it has between 30k-40k miles on it. I treat it very well :). I know that nitrous is not the best thing to be throwing in an older engine (which I can't battle, my car is as old as I am, possibly the engine too, even though it has been replaced) but the sound of the Microswitch concept made me think it could do less damage. Keyword: Less, haha. I am persuaded by you guys to look into a new engine, and I have been since I read the posts, but I am still not fully drawn away from nitrous.... It is so appealing (commence dangling of keys in front of my face as a distraction). I have plentyof time to think though; $850 doesn't just earn itself.
Last edited by dexxin on September 2nd, 2010, 3:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
'94 Blaze Red GS w/ minimal mods (under construction (; )
'03 Volkswagen GTI 1.8T (DD) Shaved airbox, 2.25" catback exhaust. Alpine IDA-X100 head unit, 1000w Kenwood Monoblock amp @ 1 ohm, 12" Kenwood sub in ported box
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Ryan
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by Ryan »

Why are you so afraid of the engine swap? If you're as intelligent as your grammar suggests, I'd rate the difficulty at a 5/10 for you.

When you consider fuel mileage, you must remember that also, nitrous isn't nearly free.

and I'd like to push the legality again. At 16, you can't afford to screw around with the cops. 99.9% of cops won't spot a KL swap even if they look, but a nitrous bottle isn't so easy to hide.
Now with Moderator power!

Black '93 BP RS - wrecked, parted, scrapped.
Green GS - Sold.
Black GS - Summer DD/Race car - Fancy KLZE
Red GS - K8-ATX -> MTX-KLDE - Frakencar. Scrapped
White GS - Rusty. Parts. Scrapped
1997 BMW M3 - my summer baby
2002 BMW 325Xi - sold
2003 Forester Xti - EJ20K swapped.
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h3xt0r
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by h3xt0r »

Ryan: You have some good points about the problem of Legality that I never really considered. Dex you may want to look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrous_oxide#Legality" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As far as engine is concerned, snag a KLDE. I will be doing a swap soon here recording my progress and in general doing a video log of what I am doing. When completed you can see what I did, see my mistakes, and prevent yourself from making the same mistakes that I did. The Swap is more along the lines of time consuming than difficult. This is of course assuming you're like me and methodical about these kind of things.

As far as the Nitrous is concerned, I think you get the idea now. ;)
-H3xT0r
kateCapshaw wrote:The moment somebody says to me, "This is very risky," is the moment it becomes attractive to me.
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RS_OBD'oh_2
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by RS_OBD'oh_2 »

You sound smart and all.. but I do have issues with a 16 year old and N2O. We've all done some dumb sh!t on the roads in our younger years. Power and lack of experience is not a good combination. Don't take this as a shot on you, but I'm sure you'd be pressured into a demo at one point or another.

I respect your searching skillz and how much your willing to find out on your own. We've had quite the influx of lazy members in the last little while. Thank you for showing up the other noobs.
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h3xt0r
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by h3xt0r »

RS_OBD'oh_2 wrote:You sound smart and all.. but I do have issues with a 16 year old and N2O. We've all done some dumb sh!t on the roads in our younger years. Power and lack of experience is not a good combination. Don't take this as a shot on you, but I'm sure you'd be pressured into a demo at one point or another.

I respect your searching skillz and how much your willing to find out on your own. We've had quite the influx of lazy members in the last little while. Thank you for showing up the other noobs.
I was 16 when I first started playing with N20, granted I have been driving since I was 13. :-P Think I might be an exception to the rules. Though, in retrospect, I wish I didn't because I spent easily 5k in parts and fixing stuff. Most of the money I had saved up for a while. :-P
-H3xT0r
kateCapshaw wrote:The moment somebody says to me, "This is very risky," is the moment it becomes attractive to me.
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by Sleeper6 »

Alright so after scanning all this, what are your plans for the fuel system? Nitrous by function puts more burnable air in the system and you will need to be able to provide ample fuel to keep up or you will be looking at a dangerous lean out condition. So you should definaty be looking into a higher flow fuel pump as well as an upgrade for your cooling, think coolder thermostat and some better fans atleast, more power will result in more heat.

Also another important tid bit is that most techs will only recomend about a 10hp per cylinder on a stock worn engine (ie 194,xxxmiles) so I wouldnt go past a 50 shot to be safe, as well as your going to want to invest in a way to monitor your bottle temp, I doubt a heater will be necessairy in TX but you need to keep in mind that temp will affect the pressure inside, so yes you want to have a gauge and if you go wet a way to purge out the vapor in the lines as well. I would look into a cry02 setup as well if you have the spare money.

Finally a last bit. If you didnt understand what 50/75 shot ment I honestly doubt you seriously looked into the needs of a proper nitrous setup or fully understand how it works. And I would hate to see someone get hurt or ruin a car on the basis of a good intentioned "mechanic" who installs something improperlly or unsafely that can ultimately end up hurting your or worst case you loose control someone else. And If you have the resources to burn on a proper nitrous install, spend them better on suspension which will yeild better times for you or as said before a 2.5l swap, they really arnt that expensive compared to a properlly set up reliable nitrous system.
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Daninski
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by Daninski »

Yes , the pick n pull. You never know what you might find there. viewtopic.php?f=15&t=75033&start=0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You would need to budget for new hoses belts etc and also a stronger clutch that will run you around $400. As far as running AC who says you can't. Of course you can. Simply disconnect the compressor from the engine and tie it off to hang then pull the engine. Install the ZE and reconnect the compressor.
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dexxin
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by dexxin »

It is 2:35 A.M. and I just got done doing homework. I have read all of the replies, but I cannot respond to them all right now; I am WAY too tired. I will respond tomorrow (at about this same time; Friday night football in Texas is serious business). I will say in advance that I really appreciate everyone's input and I am seriously considering all the options that have been presented to me.

Replies/explanations/justifications will be up tomorrow...


Sam
'94 Blaze Red GS w/ minimal mods (under construction (; )
'03 Volkswagen GTI 1.8T (DD) Shaved airbox, 2.25" catback exhaust. Alpine IDA-X100 head unit, 1000w Kenwood Monoblock amp @ 1 ohm, 12" Kenwood sub in ported box
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MrMazda92
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by MrMazda92 »

RS_OBD'oh_2 wrote:You sound smart and all.. but I do have issues with a 16 year old and N2O. We've all done some dumb sh!t on the roads in our younger years. Power and lack of experience is not a good combination. Don't take this as a shot on you, but I'm sure you'd be pressured into a demo at one point or another.

I respect your searching skillz and how much your willing to find out on your own. We've had quite the influx of lazy members in the last little while. Thank you for showing up the other noobs.
Lol'd, thanks RS for making my VERY early day. ;)

Dexxin, if you're gonna just store the Mx... you might want to look into selling it to a forum member here.

In which case, the cost of properly swapping a 2.5l in now would fairly well even out when you sell the car to a fellow enthusiast.

Just food for thought. ;)

Also, pics of the car would be nice! Show us what you're working with! =)
Daily:
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'08 Suburban LT 4WD - TVS 1900 Blower, LF SC Cam, headers, AFM delete, true 5" lift, 33x12s, 523 WHP

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dexxin
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Re: Am I ready for a Nitrous Kit?

Post by dexxin »

Hey everyone, sorry for abandoning this thread, high school gets really crazy with AP classes. Anyways, I have come to many decisions about the future of Andy, my MX-3, thanks to some good mechanics, knowledgeable performance experts, and funds from my dad (who likes to live vicariously through me (: ). Here is the order of things that are happening FOR SURE to my car in this next week.

1. Replace valve cover gaskets.
2. Get bass blocker for my door speaker amp (if only my sound system would translate into HP... Then I would be in business!)
3. Magnaflow 2.5" in 2.5" out Hi-Flow Cat with 2.5" exhaust all the way to my muffler. I'm keeping the offset Flowtech Afterburner on to keep some backpressure. Yes, I have read the articles on here about how Mazdas do not need backpressure, but hey, I'm not hurting anyone by saving myself some money.
4. First time at the track on Friday!

Take note, all that is happening this week, as I have found great deals on all of the above purchases/installation with reliable people. And no, not the kind of reliable where you actually mean "I hope this guy is reliable, because he is really shady," but actually reliable. As for my future investments, (hopefully not too far away; my dad seems to be getting more and more into my car as I find more things to do to it) I have one decision completely decided and one that is in the works. Get ready for mass chaos:

I WILL be installing a 50 shot Nitrous Oxide Wet kit in my car. Alright, let the flaming begin.

I did a lot of research, talked to a myriad of people and watched some pretty cool videos about Nitrous (the last thing doesn't really matter, it's just fun) and decided my car will be able to handle the kit. The new guy installing my kit even clarified the legal status of NOS in a car for me; his brother is a police officer. As long as the bottle is labeled with the correct Nitrous Oxide stickers, it is fine to possess. If it is unmarked, the bottle and possibly the car could be confiscated for Transportation of a Hazardous Material. So after everyone is angry now, let me cool your jets with some good news:

As I said before, my dad is really getting into the performance enhancement of my car. Today, he texted me at school and told me he had been calling around to find something "special" for me. He didn't find one; he found two. Two KL-ZE J-Specs 30 minutes from my house. $750 a pop. I told him that this was a super epic deal and he understood. I got him to read through the KL-ZE swap so he would understand that it really is pretty much a bolt on application. So guys, it looks like I may be picking up the legendary KL-ZE. We are going on Saturday to check them out and make sure they are in good shape (and maybe pick up one (; ).

I want to thank everyone in this thread for giving their opinions and I hope we can still continue this discussion after some of these advancements I have made. As for pictures, I will try and take some soon and post them in this thread. It is really nothing too special (to the average person), but I do love my baby.
'94 Blaze Red GS w/ minimal mods (under construction (; )
'03 Volkswagen GTI 1.8T (DD) Shaved airbox, 2.25" catback exhaust. Alpine IDA-X100 head unit, 1000w Kenwood Monoblock amp @ 1 ohm, 12" Kenwood sub in ported box
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