Clutch bleeding for dummies?

neumann · Post by **neumann** » September 1st, 2006, 8:05 pm

sorry for the dumb post but I am trying to get finished on my clutch line replacement as described in this thread:
http://www.mx-3.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=53787

I have got the line installed and have begun the bleeding but any of the instructions I have assume you actually know what you are doing. This is certainly not an accurate description of my skill level.

Anyhow I have been doing this myself so am running back and forth depressing the clutch pedal, tightening the bleed screw, raising the pedal, loosening the screw etc. I have a nice pool of fluid expelled from the bleed screw, I have been adding DOT 3 fluid to the reservoir as it goes down etc so there is definitely fluid making its way through the system. However i think there is still air in there too. When I close things off the clutch pedal is like granite. The bleed tube I have is probably less than ideal - a 3/8 inch vinyl tube and i am certainly not getting any pressure through it either way.

Looking for any pointers, even- especially- the obvious ones on what exactly i am trying to do

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » September 1st, 2006, 8:38 pm

OMG neumann, by yourself?? OK, that'll only work if you're using speedbleeders where they'll spring back closed after the pedal pressure is removed.
Routine brake bleeding procedure - 2 person method (a must)
1. Have the slave cylinder bleed screw cracked a pinch from fully tight.
2. Maintain the box end wrench over the bleed screw.
3. Attach clear tubing to the end of the bleed nipple and have it terminate into a glass jar that already has some brake fluid in it (used brake fluid is fine). The end of the tube that terminates into the glass jar must be always kept submersed in the brake fluid in there. This will prevent air from being drawn back up into the tube accidentally.
4. Reservoir topped up and lid off.
5. While the #2 person is positioned with the box end wrench on the bleed screw, have the #1 person pump the clutch pedal 3 to 4 times and at the 4th pump, keep applying pressure on the pedal.
6. While the pressure on the clutch pedal is maintained, have the #2 person open the bleed screw slightly. Fluid should squirt out down the tube and into the jar.
7. Once it appears that the fluid stops expelling, close the bleed screw and tell the #1 person to release pressure on the clutch pedal.
8. Repeat steps 5 thru 7.
The stiffer the pedal will eventually get is an indication that your nearing completion.
That should just about do it .... I think.

SloGsr · Post by **SloGsr** » September 1st, 2006, 10:34 pm

the glass jar idea is great and works well but I've had a lot of luck doing it myself like this:
1. fill the resivor
2. pump the pedal about 10 times (if it don't come back up on it's own just pull it up with your hand. not very common but it can happen)
3. open the bleeder valve fully and continue to add fluid while the valve is open. continue to do this until the fluid comes out as fast as it goes in.
4. close the valve.

this is known as the gravity bleed method. It should take about 5 min. and you can do it by your self.

PATDIESEL · Post by **PATDIESEL** » September 2nd, 2006, 10:24 pm

Gravity bleeding is much more likely to leave air in the line though and for the "best" result you need to use the two person method. Surely a buddy will sit and pump the pedal for 5 minutes for you.

lakersfan1 · Post by **lakersfan1** » September 3rd, 2006, 12:35 am

8mm Speedbleeder. Can't get any easier than that.

neumann · Post by **neumann** » September 3rd, 2006, 5:42 pm

lakersfan1 wrote:8mm Speedbleeder. Can't get any easier than that.

Looks great. It would appear to address the issue effectively.

I emailed speedbleeder.com to ask about the proper size but does anyone know ? I am not expectig a speedy bleeding response just because its labor day weekend but I would like to order the part.

The 8mm part # for MX-3 brakes appears to be SB8100 but there are 3 other 8MM sizes listed.

Spinkx79 · Post by **Spinkx79** » September 5th, 2006, 11:51 am

neumann wrote:
lakersfan1 wrote:8mm Speedbleeder. Can't get any easier than that.
Looks great. It would appear to address the issue effectively.

I emailed speedbleeder.com to ask about the proper size but does anyone know ? I am not expectig a speedy bleeding response just because its labor day weekend but I would like to order the part.

The 8mm part # for MX-3 brakes appears to be SB8100 but there are 3 other 8MM sizes listed.

If you find them can you pm me please. I have the SS brake and clutch lines to go in and wanted to add these as well.

Thanks

MX3ak · Post by **MX3ak** » September 6th, 2006, 6:08 pm

This fluid from the clutch is the same from the brakes, right?

Is this OK to mix Dot3 with Dot4 ? or do we have to drop all the fluid out to put some diferent grade?...

Thanks

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » September 7th, 2006, 12:22 am

MX3ak wrote:This fluid from the clutch is the same from the brakes, right?
Is this OK to mix Dot3 with Dot4 ? or do we have to drop all the fluid out to put some diferent grade?...
Thanks

Yes, they both share the same fluid reservoir.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brake_fluid

Cannot mix silicone based brake fluid with non-silicone brake fluid. So in essence you can use DOT 2,3, 4 and 5.1 (all non-silicone based) fluids.

neumann · Post by **neumann** » September 8th, 2006, 8:55 pm

Spinkx79 wrote:
neumann wrote:
lakersfan1 wrote:8mm Speedbleeder. Can't get any easier than that.
Looks great. It would appear to address the issue effectively.

I emailed speedbleeder.com to ask about the proper size but does anyone know ? I am not expectig a speedy bleeding response just because its labor day weekend but I would like to order the part.

The 8mm part # for MX-3 brakes appears to be SB8100 but there are 3 other 8MM sizes listed.
If you find them can you pm me please. I have the SS brake and clutch lines to go in and wanted to add these as well.

Thanks

I just ordered the speed bleeder from speedbleeder.com

I didn't get an email reply so I called them up. They were not quite sure about the clutch slave cylinder part but since I knew it was 8mm, and I knew the front brakes for the MX-3 took the SB8100 and they told me that others had successfully used the SB8100 on clutch release of the later Gen 1 Miatas, I figured it was worth a shot.

The differences with the other 8MM sizes appear to be threading and overall length, so I figure thatif nothing else, the same threading and length as used on the MX-3 Front Brakes makes sense.

PM sent to Spinkx79

V8KOMX3 · Post by **V8KOMX3** » September 8th, 2006, 11:22 pm

why a speed bleeder you can't tell me you don't have another person to help u for 5 min. it woulda saved u money. owell good luck

neumann · Post by **neumann** » September 9th, 2006, 12:43 am

V8KOMX3 wrote:why a speed bleeder you can't tell me you don't have another person to help u for 5 min. it woulda saved u money. owell good luck

Yeah, last weekend I got my spousal equivalent to abandon our three month old infant for a couple of minutes to try and pump the pedal for me. Now given that we recently got a Mazda3 Sport GT (my "sensible car" concession to parenthood) and NOT the Mazdaspeed3 because she didn't want to learn to drive stick, here is how it went.

Me: "The clutch. The one on the left"
Her :"Sort of in the center?"
Me : "The left most pedal. From right to left, there is the accellerator, then the brake and then the clutch."
My beloved: "this one?" (indicating the brake pedal)
Me "No. It is the outboard pedal. The one on the left"
etc

What followed -eventually -was a few minutes of pumping one or more pedal to no great effect, after which I thanked the mother of my child for her service and she returned to her charge. I then did the running back and forth myself method.

While I definitely was getting flow out the bleed screw, I appeared to be getting air back in the system, possibly just because the hose i was using is maybe 15- 20% bigger than ideal and was sucking in air? So the fact that the speedbleeder.com people would ship to my doorstep a device that allows me not to lose my mind AND a properly fitted hose all for $10.95 plus shipping and handling strikes me as reasonable.

I could try and get my brother to come over. At least he can follow directions. But generally the reason i work on my cars is not driven by passion, nor economy, but because I find it tiresome to try and get someone else involved. I work on my Porsche because my very excellent mechanic is two hours away. There is an established Porsche mechanic 3 blocks away but it is just such an incredible pain to get him to commit to a time to work on my car that I would rather do it myself.

I started changing my own oil just because i could not bear to deal with getting someone else to do it. I bought a $6 23MM combination wrench just so that I could change my own tranny fluid. I bought a $7 29MM combination wrench so that i could change the temperature sensor on my porsche. I even got amusement out of the fact that I had a set of wrenches that included every size starting from 6mm to 28MM but skipping 20 and 23. Chagrin would be the polite word for me emerging from the car realizing that the rusted seized tranny plug did not fit the 24 mm tool in my hand.

I still have found no other uses for the 23mm and 29mm tools. Even if i never ever use those tools again they were - to me anyhow - cheap compared to the hassle of trying to setup an appointment with a mechanic, or borrow a tool, or beg someone to indulge me.

I expect mileage will vary

neumann · Post by **neumann** » September 24th, 2006, 1:03 pm

Ok, so I have installed the CorkSport Stainless Steel clutch line and attempted to bleed myself.

Now I added the speedbleeder SB8100 bleed screw and attached a new, properly fitted bleed hose. The other end is in a closed bag also provided by speedbleeder. After fully tightening the bleed screw I loosened it by about 1/3 turn and then began pumping the clutch pedal while pausing to top up the fluid in the reservoir (cap is off)

I am getting good fluid flow throught the bleed screw into the hose into the bag, the reservoir is going down by a half inch or so every 10 pedal pumps. There are no obvious leaks of fluid coming from elsewhere.

However the pedal is not developing any real resistance. When I have the bleed screw cracked, I can push the pedal to the floor with almost no feel, but then i have to pull it back up by hand. If I tighten the screw and close off the system with the clutch pedal in the fully up position, it then is like granite. I can't even depress the clutch to start the engine.

What am i doing wrong? Do i have to pump a ton more fluid throught the system before it will pressurize? Is the slave cylinder shot?

Heeeellllllp

neumann · Post by **neumann** » September 27th, 2006, 7:40 am

I feel bad for gratuitous bumping, especially considering how gracious folks have been in providing excellent advice but...

BUMP

MX-3.com

Clutch bleeding for dummies?

Clutch bleeding for dummies?

Please help

BUMP