Engine swap for dummies

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zreak
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Engine swap for dummies

Post by zreak »

I need to replace my old 1.8 with a new one, cuz I broke the old one.. :(

I don't think I can afford or pull off doing a 2.5 switch.

I'm a complete newb when it comes to working with cars, though I have some friends that will help.

My first question is
what to look for when I'm buying an engine?
I've found a couple of engines from two different UK-shops.
From '98 with ~40' miles on them for £300 + £180 shipping + tax [+25%]
[I'm from Norway, shipping from the US will probably be to expensive]

Do you need a lot of mechanical skill [like a mechanic] to just switch the engine, or is it just a puzzle where you need to make sure you replace all cables correctly?

I'm getting all kinda comments from ppl I know, you can't do this yourself, you can just overhaul the old engine, leave it all to the workshop, lol how could you wreck you engine?

I seriously can't afford to put the car in the shop, but I'm afraid that I can't do it myself either...
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Post by Custommx3 »

Start by reading the FAQ, there is a how to in there. If you dont feel you can accomplish it, then youd have to have someone else to it obviously. Got any tech car buddies?
WTF
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Post by WTF »

At least you need some basic skills. I guarantee you this, reading a book with all the step by step is one thing and performing the job is totally different.

The main concern I have if you are a newbie with tools is SAFETY. Try to find somebody who at least has some experience with tools and swap.

Ripping stuff out is easy, the difficult part is putting everything back in. Even if the book says its done in a special order, it depends on each situation on how things go back together. On my first few tries I had to pull the engine out a few times cause I would forget to install this, or after the engine is in, there is no way to access this side of the block, or its physically impossibler to adjust or tighetn those screws if done in a specific way. Dont want to scare you, but its challenging.

About overhaulin its very easy to screw up. Apply the incorrect torque specs or just torque it in the incorect sequence and you are screwed. For example, rod bearings have to be installed in a specific way, piston rings have a specific layout and torque. How about honing the block when installing new piston rings, how to put the pistons in the chambers? Its not as easy as it looks. If I were you, I would not rebuilt the engine yet, baby steps, changin rings and bearings is not very hard from the engine bay.

You know whats going to happen? You are new to this stuff, start ripping the engine, changing this and that, here and there; then after three weeks of major surgery hit the ignition key and the engine does not start...!#@? Where do you start? There will be so many variables on the table its going to be difficult to troubleshoot.

I got a friend who wants me to work on a Honda Del Sol with a CRV block and GSR head, MSD system , ported head, APEX etc, etc. I see the engione and it scares me cause I dont know, so much has been done to the vehicle that maybe is a cable, maybe is a relay, a fuse, etc.

1. Grab yourself a digital camera, take pictures of everything, before, between and after. Label all the cables with durable masking tape and sharpie, A1 to A1, or sensorA to sensor A, mark the plugs, paint them, more pictures.

2. Read and memorize most of the procedure from the Haynes Manual.

3. Write down what you are doing, #1-removed cylinder heads.

4. Get ziplock bags, boxes, and divide parts by cylinder head, engine block, transmission, the key here is orgasnization.

5. Be patient, take your time and try to have a second vehicle, do not exepct to finish on a timeframe if this is your first swap, like the saying;

Hope for the best and expect the worst.

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/430130/1

Email or PM if you have any questions. I got some pictures from my build, let me know and I can email a CD with them.
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WTF
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Part 2.

Post by WTF »

For the swap the passenger side engine mount is needed. Verify the speedo is the same, sometimes they do change, remember you have to add 2 more signals:

1. for the VICS solenoid

2. Another one for the distributor
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zreak
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Post by zreak »

Thanks for the first input.

I love this car and I really want it right.

I have a couple of friends that are going to help me, they have worked a lot on cars before, just not this, and don't think they have switched an engine. But as we've come to realize this car is very special and there's not much room around the engine.

I've got a secondary vehicle, my old lojal Golf :) So there's no big hurry, I just miss my mx3.

My dad says the wiring will be a pain in the a.. but doable, if you have the time, but when it comes to the transmission and the clutch I'll have trouble, and might not have the right tools.. What special tools do you need?

Are you refering to the "FAQ: 2.5L KL engine swap info" regarding swapping the engine? I've read through a couple of 2.5 switches, and I realize it'll be a lot of work simply switching to a 1.8, and I'd guess it'll take me a month. But as a student I'd have to use 2-3 months of pay to put the car in the shop...
zreak
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Post by zreak »

So what do I need to check / know when buying an engine from overseas? When I can't check the engine?

I looked through the manual found on this page, about removal and installation, and I fear it'll be to much for me and a couple of friends to do.
I'm going to get professional help installing it, just have to spend all the money I saved up working this summer. Gotta get my baby running again, breaks my heart seeing her standing there without a working engine :cry: :cry:
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Post by bmwm3guy »

trust me dude, it isnt all that complicated. Don't underestimate your searching and reading skills, because thats what this swap is all about. Just read, read, read and just when you think you can run through the process in your mind, read again. The swap is really not all that hard at all. :D

it is essentially take the old motor out, and drop in an (almost) identical one. Label everything with masking tape and number each connector with a piece of paper explaining where each number was plugged/what it is... it'll take a few extra hours but you'll save a lot of headaches.

Oh, and dont say to yourself "Oh I dont need to label that, I KNOW what that is.... yeah... label it, because a week (or a few days, depending on how it goes) from now you're not gonna remember fack all.
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Post by hgallegos915 »

yes yes SUPER easy..everything i bold on.. you dont even need a book:/ The distributor bolts right on and off, only has 2 positions. Everything likes up. If you leave the egr out its even easier..well imo. Also pull engine AND transmission at the same time. Its easier to seperate it when its out.
-hec

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Post by Rick Johnson »

:werd: It's pretty simple, you could train a monkey to do it.
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Post by PATDIESEL »

Wow, there is alot of unnecessary info in some of these replies. First disragard all the inof that the guy gave about changing and torqing rod bearings and stuff, that is WAY over your head and if you try to overhaul the motor as a newb you'll have no chance at getting it right and just waste your time and money. Overhauling an engine requires some VERY specific work and you just don't have the skill for it yet.

Read some swap directions, all the ones here and maybe mine also. Mine is not broken down into enough small steps to make it easy to read, but it is one of the more complete set-by-step instructions. http://www.atlantamx3.com/mocaforum/viewforum.php?f=7

A swap is not that hard, repalceing a K8 for a newer K8 is the easiest, but a KL swap is not that much more work. A KL-ZE is not much harder then a KL-DE since they are basically the same motor. The only differences in a DE and a ZE swap are the intake manifold on a ZE needs to be changed for a Millinea DE manifold and the vacuum is a bit different since a ZE doesn't have EGR.

So read some swap pages and then if you understand the directions start buying parts. While saving and buying parts keep reading. The more you understand the easier it will be. I know there are a few Mx-3 members in Norway, try contacting them for help. You'll make a friend and they may have done a swap already.
I knew a decent amount about cars before I did my ZE swap and was also a bit scared I'd mess something up when I first started the swap. However, after taking it out and making sure I had everything labeled I knew it was going to be alot easier than I had thought.
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Post by Gro Harlem »

doing a simple 2.5 KLDE swap is NOT going to be more expensive than a K8.


If anything, finding a used, decent K8 is going to prove more difficult & more expensive since there are fewer of them out there. There are MANY KLDE's out there that you can pick from & they were made up until 2002 so you can easily find a good-as-hell condition one.

If possible, get one from a millenia, you'll get the KLZE heads & curved neck manifold, but you'll still have the lower compression pistons. If not, just get a normal probe/mx6/626 one and swap on your intake manifod.


And the swap is RIDICULOUSLY EASY! There is nothing you need to know whatsoever to do the swap. It is as simple as unbolting your old & pulling it out (with a helper i hope) and putting the new one in.


Getting new parts is up to you, but is a good idea. Timing belt, water pump, valve cover gaskets, thermostat, new clutch are all IMO necessities and will add 300-400 additional cost to the swap, but you'd still have to buy this stuff for a K8 anyways, but again, its up to you. If your engine's timing belt breaks after you install it and drive it for 4k miles then its your own damn fault for being a cheapass & lazyass, so replace it when its out and 10000 times easier!
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Post by bigtime »

well said mr harlem..
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Post by schuttie2002 »

Everything on the swap is so well documented around this site, it makes it a pretty easy task. Rusted and broken bolts, plus labeling like crazy takes the longest time, but its not a big deal at all. Like Gro said though, change parts that would be a pain to do once the engines in the car. Also just my 2 cents, but if your going to swap, just save a little more and go to some form of a 2.5l v6. I just did the DE swap this summer and its fricken amazing.

Good luck
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Post by Reaver19 »

I killed my K8 engine in my MX-3 right now it's sitting. My uncle who is a mechanic knows a guy who can get me a K8 engine for 650 and it's got low mileage on it, you saying that a K8 costs the same as another engine swap might now be 100% accurate =P I'd be glad if you could prove me wrong and show me that I could get a better engine swapped in for 650 but I know the ZE's start at 800 and you also have to buy other parts for it to take the engine on top of that. I don't know what the DE's cost, or if they need other components to work with the car though...
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Post by hgallegos915 »

pfft ill give you my old k8 for 200 dllrs plus shiipping.. BEAT THAT... 600 dllrs IS WAY too much for a k8... that engine is so freaking slow.. It has a descent pull BUT CMON... for the same price you can get a klde /FKZE/K8ZE/ maybe even a KLZE.. I suggest a millenia klde if you cant get the klze.. and TRUST ME! you eill never regret it.. EVER. Even better if you get a low milege engine you may only need to swap the timing belt or not even. I got my ffze with around 24-30 k miles and it is super quiet...no tapping..oil doesnt turn black right away like. Even if you do get a k8 on that you you MUST change timing eblt pump and seals..that engine is notorious for having bad seals if it has high milleage..parts for it are expensive..try going to autozone and getting simple parts for it..and you eill see...now as far as a kl..parts are cheaper for some reason.. You have more potential with a kl for future mods. Also FILL you mounts..or replace them ..on mine all of them where bad but my friend cory rice Hooooooked me up! :)
-hec

MX-3 w/ curved neck millenia klde, boosted @ 5 psi. /bov and wastegate are good!/ nitto drag radial/ gutted interior/ millenia red top injectors, vortech fmu/aem wideband/ all bolts ons/ Car put together 100% by me. Mechanic? who needs a mechanic? ew.. real men work on their own cars!
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