A Good Combination For Pads and Rotors?

Nd4SpdSe · Post by **Nd4SpdSe** » March 13th, 2005, 11:34 am

I'm looking at getting a very good set of pads and rotors something around the end of this month, not a big brake kit, but an OEM upgrade that can handle some consistant heavy braking...my current set of rotors turned blue from some the insane driving at the '03 Ottawa Mazda Meet, and since I'm planing on attending this year, I want to make sure my braking capabilities will be more than adequate for the "cruise".

I was looking at the Brembo Cross Drilled and Slotted Rotors and the Akebono Ceramic Pads off of PSITuning.ca, but I can't believe how much you can spend for consumable items, that and I'm sure you'd be paying for the Brembo name on the rotors...anyway, I have no knowledge on brakes and which would be a good set...I just don't want to buy the most expensive set, assuming that's the ideal combination, or even that that those will work, and regreting it later.

All i know is that I want slotted and drilled rotors to help vent the gases and heat from heavy braking...although I am partial to the Brembo rotors because of the zinc color would look nice with my gunmetal rims

nope-mx3 · Post by **nope-mx3** » March 13th, 2005, 12:16 pm

I have ordered Brembo discs and Porterfield pads.

Should work allright I guess.

nope-mx3

tatsu · Post by **tatsu** » March 13th, 2005, 12:18 pm

The Brembo Sport drilled/slotted rotors are great, but for the price, they'd better be! The advantage to them, apparently, is uniformity of construction and perhaps a slightly different material than normal - this SHOULD make them less likely to warp, and help them dissipate heat a little better. Are they worth the price? Who knows...

We've had good experience with the cheapest rotors we could find - the "Ultra-8" from Altrom, which are about $100 CDN (plus tax) for all four. They are cheap enough that you could justify cooking a set completely for a weekend at the track, and they have not warped, cracked or had any kind of unusual wear for us over 40,000 kms of street use.

For track use, I would consider having them cross-drilled by a reputable racing shop, but make sure that they properly radius or chamfer the holes so they don't chew your pads to bits! Out here on the left coast, I have had Hyperformance recommended to me by a local tuner. This will obviously add a bit to the cost, but even if they charge $200 CDN, you'd still be coming in $100 under what the Brembo rotors will cost you.

On the subject of pads, we have used PBR Metalmasters (listed on PSITuning, and also available from Altrom dealers) for the past two years. My only complaint is a lack of feel - other than that, they've been good. For our next upgrade, I'll be using the PBR ULX Ceramic pads ($120 CDN for all four wheels, so a wee bit cheaper than the Akebono), which are supposed to be even better performing, with better feel, but with slightly more brake dust.

Nd4SpdSe · Post by **Nd4SpdSe** » March 13th, 2005, 2:37 pm

So those Brembo's are probably the way to go.

Where do they sell those PBR ULX Ceramic pads you mentioned...they sound tempting...

nope-mx3 · Post by **nope-mx3** » March 13th, 2005, 3:15 pm

I paid $198 for my 4 Brembo discs on Ebay.
The pads was $160 (directly from Porterfield)

both were plus shipping, so to Norway, the grand total was about $470,
and here in Norway, I couldnt get original Mazdaparts for this I believe.

Now I get good performance stuff, and it`ll be interesting to see how it works.

nope-mx3

TsiMiata · Post by **TsiMiata** » March 13th, 2005, 7:48 pm

My personal preference is Hawk HP+ pads, stainless brake lines and synthetic brake fluid. The cross drilled/slotted rotors will only make your overheating problem worse. There is less metal to absorb the heat so the metal that is left will overheat faster. Short of thicker or larger discs the only way you'll prevent that blueing is with air ducts blowing cool air onto the rotors.

Gro Harlem · Post by **Gro Harlem** » March 13th, 2005, 8:33 pm

Definitely get brembo rotors, but why get cross drilled or slotted? You will NOT see any difference in braking performance with these rotors, you might as well save 3 times your money and go with some blank brembo discs. I just ordered a set of blanks from nopi for $24 each for the fronts

I currently have x-drilled bremo's, but when i took them in to get resurfaced NO one would/could do them b/c of the holes drilled in them. So...they were a complete waste of my money since I can't resurface them, so I"m going with OEM brembo blanks.

As for pads, up to you and what you want. Lots of dust? No dust? amazing performance? quiet? it all depends. I went with NO dust and got axxis deluxe organic pads. they are s--- for performance but produce no dust. I have hawk pads waiting to go on the front and i'm ordering metalmasters for the rear soon. Going to redo my brake system this spring (for the 3rd time)

jaydog5678 · Post by **jaydog5678** » March 13th, 2005, 8:56 pm

The Hawk HP+ pads is what I used for my track experience at little "Taledega Grand Prix" last year. I used EBC's cross drilled/slotted rotors with stock drums in the back. The pads are an improvment to say the least, however the only draw back to these pads are noise and dust. For the street, these pads at $50 for a pair are a great upgrade. For the track (in my case) they wore the crap out of my rotors in half a day of racing. The brake fade was incredible, but then I'm also slowing down from nearly 100mph in a very short distance on the straight away. Gas, brake, gas, brake for 5 laps. I ended up smoking the rotors, literally. The HP+ pads have some serious bite, hence the wore out rotors in a short period of time.

Nd4SpdSe · Post by **Nd4SpdSe** » March 14th, 2005, 8:52 am

Gro Harlem wrote:As for pads, up to you and what you want. Lots of dust? No dust? amazing performance? quiet? it all depends. I went with NO dust and got axxis deluxe organic pads. they are s--- for performance but produce no dust. I have hawk pads waiting to go on the front and i'm ordering metalmasters for the rear soon. Going to redo my brake system this spring (for the 3rd time)

Hmm, haven't though about those aspects. Performance with as little brake fade as possible, and a "good feel" is what I would like. Dust isn't really too big of an issue, but i would like the pads to last about a summer of heavy use. As for noise, as long as it's not some high-pitched squeeling, I wouldnt worry about noise.

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » March 14th, 2005, 1:09 pm

Nd4SpdSe wrote:So those Brembo's are probably the way to go.
Where do they sell those PBR ULX Ceramic pads you mentioned...they sound tempting...

I like the idea of that combo, coupled with teflon braided lines and it will make all the difference in the world. I say this because I've been using brembo (heavy cast) crossed drilled rotors on my Ducati for 16 years. Still using original brembo single piston (very small) calipers with teflon braided lines and it's never showed any signs of fade, on the street or track. Only downside is the weight of my brembo's, although their (Brembo's) technology has probably kept pace with the worlds racing needs and are much lighter today, I would look to comparing their weight to other performance rotors also. As mentioned in the wheel / tire size thread, the aspects of unsprung weight must be considered, that includes the rotor and caliper weight. Something to look at... I may be doing a brake upgrade next winter and I personally would seriously consider the combo mentioned above. Oh ya, whatever you do decide on, you absolutely have to replace the rubber brake lines with teflon braided lines, and even if you dont do the brakes now, do the lines anyway - will still give a noticeable difference to your stock set-up. Oh, while your at it, do the clutch line too, if not that may be the weak link in the hydraulic system. It'll improve the clutch feel and operation amazingly. And those braided lines last forever (little exageration...lol). Nd4SpdSe, let us know what develops.

Nd4SpdSe · Post by **Nd4SpdSe** » March 14th, 2005, 1:23 pm

Well, i ordered the Brembo drilled/slotted rotors today, I wanna give those a shot. I have a stainless clutch line that my mechanic didn't install cause he said it wouldn't make a difference. I bought it when I was doing my swap and still have it, i was planing on putting it on when I get my brake lines done.

I was planing to do stainless steel brake lines, but is there a different between those and teflon braided lines?

If Tatsu responds back, i would like to find a Canadian distributor for those pads and order them.

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » March 14th, 2005, 3:45 pm

SS brake lines as known now, but I believe they're (teflon braided lines) one in the same (old school speaking here). The inside is a teflon line hence the ability to use a higher / better grade brake fluid and of course the outside is braided steel (SS). The benefits of which like I said above but also (motorcycle speak) wrt rubber lines, the constant on and off pressure applied to rubber lines added to the heat transferance from the caliper will enable the brake fluid to have a much quicker chemical reation to the rubber lines (rubber + petroleum). Basically degrading the wall strength and integrity of the rubber lines. This in time allows the rubber lines to expand when pressure is applied rather than transfering that pressure to the caliper or slave cylinder (clutch). Depending on the amount of aggressive use or use period and time in use, all of our rubber lines will degrade to a certain point. Whether we wait till one fatigues (like I did with my clutch line) or we proactively tend to these sometimes forgotten items is up to the individual. The other plus to SS lines is that, because of the chemical reation between the rubber lines and the brake fluid, the integrity (and therefore the effectiveness) of the brake fluid is diminished to a degree. This is quite noticeable in motorcycles by the colour change of the brake fluid in the reservoir (darkened). SS brake lines (and clutch line) all but eliminates any chemical reation, and the requirement for periodic bleeding is almost unnecessary.
Nd4SpdSe, your mechanic was blowing smoke up your a$$, it will make a difference. If you're still, or if any MX is still running their original clutch line, they would be better served to replace it...and why not with a SS line. I think the price between the 2 is negligible, when weighing the benefits. Let us know how it turns out.

jschrauwen · Post by **jschrauwen** » March 14th, 2005, 3:56 pm

Nd4SpdSe, almost forgot, since it looks like you're doing the full meal deal, have you considered putting new seal kits on your calipers and bring everything up to newness. I noticed that you painted your calipers already but wasn't sure if part of that facelift included a new seal kit at the same time. FWIW, cheers

Nd4SpdSe · Post by **Nd4SpdSe** » March 14th, 2005, 5:07 pm

So Teflon braided brake line ARE SS brake Lines?

What's a guestimate on a seal kit?

Hmm, my capliers are not painted, their just stock.

Gro Harlem · Post by **Gro Harlem** » March 14th, 2005, 5:38 pm

the rotors aren't going to help your brake feel, and may reduce fade if you are racing but never when you are driving on the street. I still think you should've invested the money you'd have saved buying blanks on some SS lines as well. You can get a set of them for like 85 on nopionline.com

Lines help feel a lot, also make sure your calipers and sliders are up to par and work properly. Caliper rebuild kit may be a good idea.