thought's on redline waterwetter

[tonguefreek]

i thought i would try it to see if it really dose work and as i thought it did not do any thing that i noticed i have 3 cyberdyne gauges oil temp water temp and oil pressure before i added it my water temp was 202 and my oil temp was 180 this is at a outside temp of 40 and car warmed up and going 65 mph on the highway after i added it and flushed out my coolent system i got the same temps as before just thought i would post this incase any is intersted in the info

[TsiMiata]

It won't reduce your operating temps. It only helps with heat transfer fromthe block to the water. it also helps to prevent localized boiling points. Your thermostat is what maintains the water temp. Unless it had failed or the cooling system couldn't keep up you'll see exactly what you saw. Which is no change in the coolant temps with the addition of water wetter.

I personally think it is a waste of $$. Just put in distilled water and the lowest ratio of antifreeze you can get away with.

[curtklze]

its true purpose is to work with Race engines that only run water.

At the track they dont want cars that have a good chance of crashing or blowing the engine to run antifreeze cause it cant be cleaned off the track quickly (tust me its a ****** to clean).

But straight water will corrode the internal parts of the engine.

as well the water pump need to be lubricated by either coolant or watetr wetter.

also water does not transfer heat as well as water mixed with coolant or water weter.

so.. racers run wter wetter to prevent corosion and to increase heat transfer thereby increasing the cooling to the engine.

[TsiMiata]

Originally posted by curtklze:
also water does not transfer heat as well as water mixed with coolant or water weter.

Thats only half right. Water by itself is much better at transferring heat with no antifreeze in it than with it.

[Steeb]

water wetter does work but unless u have a more accurate temp guage than the stock one your needle wont be much lower due to accuracy. my friends sr20det dropped 15 degrees celcius at idle, monitored with an apex power fc. results will vary.

[IanL]

Then your friend's car has a fault. The cooling system should maintain the same temperature at idle, irrespective of water wetter, as said above. If water wetter lowered the temperature, either the thermostat is faulty, the fan wasn't running when it should, the water pump is sick or the water passages are somewhat blocked.

[mrspanky79]

ok lets make this simple the thermostat opean up at a given temputer to let water go throw the rad to cool down now if you sitting at ideal the coolent is not going loose much heat going thow the rad because there is no air going throw it so the temp is just going to keep rissing the thermostat has nothing to do with how hot the motor get. all it is there for is to help keep the motor from dropping bellow the operational tempature if the coolent gets to cold the thermostat closes stopping the coolent from going to the rad thos heating it up.
And yes antyfreeze helps keep your are cooler.

[TsiMiata]

you are forgetting about these things called fans. These so called "fans" move air over the radiator when you are not moving fast enough for the radiator to be cooled by flow of air. If your temp rises at idle you have OTHER issues to sort out. Such as fans not working, clogged radiator, worn water pump.

Now you are dead wrong when it comes to the antifreeze thing.

Here is a good link to help visualize and see some real numbers-
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/24_146.html

read this section- "Specific Heat Capacity of Ethylene Glycol based Water Solutions "

It shows you how much less heat an ethylene glycol(anti-freeze) solution can transfer as compared to straight water. Straight water is assumed as having a heat transfer capacity of 1(which can be though of as 100%) then the chart shows a decimal number for corresponding ratios. A number of .89 means that mixture has only 89% of the heat transfer capability of straight water.

You can see that at ~200 degrees and 70% glycol you have lost 20% of the cooling system capacity. Where as with a 30% gycol mix you lose ~7%.

It is also very important to run distilled water. Tap water has impurities that reduce its heat transfer ability. it may also contain chemicals and minerals that will more quickly corrode your engine and wear away at seals and impellers.

<small>[ March 26, 2004, 12:36 PM: Message edited by: TsiMiata ]</small>

[curtklze]

sorry, your right, water is better.

but, Im 99% sure that in an automotive application, where the watter temps can be as high as 230 deg F you will need a mix of coolant or water wetter to prevent the water from boiling.

I dont think that just the pressureized cooling system is enough to prevent straight water from boiling. but since coolant and water wetter have a higher boiling point, a mix with watter will prevent boiling, thus providing better heat transfer, since steam does not trasfer heat well at all.

[TsiMiata]

For sure you need some antifreeze in there. My thinking is you should have just enough to cover the lowest temperature you will see.

As far as boiling point of the water in a pressurized system-

A 10psi radiator cap gets you about a 230 degree boiling point.

A 14psi cap brings that up to ~250 degrees

Those numbers will change a little depending on what elevation your at and the atmospheric pressure that day.

[mrspanky79]

The fan kicks on at a given temp and can only pull so much air throw the rad now it the temp is very hot outside its not going to help that much and in stop and go trafick and trafick can make your car get real hot. And for any one that live in a cool climate in the winters what happens if you have a mix over 50/50. well lets see the car dosnot produse heat as well as if it has a mixture of 50/50 or less.

[TsiMiata]

Like I said if your fan is not up to par you will get hot.

I'm sorry if the laws of physics don't apply where you live. I'll get einstein on the phone and you cna take it up with him.

[mx3TT]

If you live in a really cold place where the temps reach about -30F, people use a 70% Antifreeze and 30% water because antifreeze raises the boiling point and lowers the freezing point. Therefor it has to get a lot hotter to boil and a lot colder to freeze.

[ikarus1]

I dunno but when I added water wetter to my brand new stock rad. stock glycol coolant Sentra SE SR20DE, it dropped the operational temps 10-15 degrees F, which was enough for me to bump my timing 4-5 degrees w/o any ill effects

[Gro Harlem]

I've read a bunch of conflicting sides about whether "water alone is better for cooling".

Based on my experiences, using a 50/50 mix is way better than using 100% water. When I first did my B6 swap into the Festiva, I was a cheap bastard and did't feel like spending $7 for antifreeze so I just filled it up with water to take it for a spin. I drove it like that for a month or so and the focker would require me to fill it up with a qt of water almost every time I came home, otherwise it'd run dry and overheat. (this was this past summer, temps were in the 80's) Once I drained and refilled with a 50/50 mix, I had no overheating problems ever.

I guess that might be b/c of the boiling point of water being at 212. I'm not sure what the boiling point of a 50/50 mix is, but it must be higher than water.