Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

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clunet
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Joined: October 26th, 2008, 10:18 am

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by clunet »

Beeping and light are caused by the little passive seatbelt control box starting to go bad under the drivers seat. I posted a fix for this a long time ago... 1999 I believe when it started to happen to my 1993 GS when I was stationed in Germany:

http://mx-3.com/tech/seatbelt-module.php

You could try and buy a new one, probably pretty pricey... I did the modification outlined in the above link, and have had no problems since...

take care,
Tim
ganue
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Location: Waterford, MI

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

Thanks.

More interested in fixing the issue, not bypassing the warning system. Did you ever research the retractor switch and what it is for and what it does? I am assuming its function is to tell the system if the belt is NOT retracted at all and force the alarm/lamp.

This is as close as I got so far but I don't like THAT solution either: http://youtu.be/E5whrmjGmbU

It appears that the retractor wants to see the belt pulled out just a bit so it opens the inputs that, when closed (= no belt travel and an assumption that you are not belted), causes the warning to beep/light.

I'll figure it out over xmas and post it here. I am guessing that the contacts are corroded causing an open where the system is looking at a grounded input or vice versa.

It's my daughter's car. I am uncomfortable enough that she has no ABS or airbags. Might as well keep this system healthy.

Right now the solution is to simply bend forward a bit causing the belt to extend by about a half inch or so which either opens or closes the switch to ground allowing the alarm/lamp to turn off.

Again - I'll document it all here on how to fix - not to bypass the system.....
Last edited by ganue on December 28th, 2013, 2:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
zstadt
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Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by zstadt »

Dang... good luck.
*'93 MX-3*
ganue
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Location: Waterford, MI

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

OK - so I figured out what was (is) going on with the seat belt buzzer. The circuit board trace has a dead (open) spot that correlates with where the belt is during normal driving.

Normal Function: The shoulder belt is wound up in the center console by a rotating spring that pulls the belt in when there is slack. There is a rotational switch that is normally closed indicating the the belt is extended by an "accepatable" amount. For US 1993 and earlier cars with the "mouse" belts, try this:

1) With the car running, the door closed and the shoulder belt retracted to the rear, detach the shoulder belt
2) Slowly let it be drawn back in by the spring in the center console.
3) Once the end of the belt reaches near the center or lower part of your chest, the belt light and warning chime should come on.
4) This happens when the rotational switch in the belt wind up mechanism open circuits indicating to the belt system that the shoulder belt is not in the proper position.

How it works:

Here's picture of the circuit board and the "wiper" that shorts the two traces together - note how dirty this is due to various spillages over the years:

Image

Imagine the circuit board lying on top of the wiper (or vice versa). The wiper is connected to a plastic gear which is, in turn, connected to the center of the roll up device. As the belt is retracted, the wiper rotates. Once the rotation is large enough the wiper will go past the traces opening the circuit and causing the lamp/warning to go on.

My Issue: There is a worn spot in the trace that causes the warning to go on while in the normal driving position.

Even after I cleaned up the traces you can see wear where the belt normally can reside - my issue was on the "Left" (driver's side) as indicated by the "L" on the circuit board:

Image

In my case the trace has an open right where the belt normally sets. Luckily, there is a wide enough area of rotation such that I rotated the wiper slightly and relative to the traces so that the area that is worn is now not normally in the driving position. So it will still beep when that location is attained, but since it is not a normal position, the annoyance of the warning while driving should not occur. Of course the right solution is a new circuit board, but we know that THAT is not going to happen.

Interestingly, this car has very low miles on it and I was told that the car was owned by two separate elderly couples. I guess the wear on the circuit board indicates that the car has had LOTS of short trips and, based on equal wear on the right side, it suggests that the couple always traveled together....aweeeeee......
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
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SuperK
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Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by SuperK »

:love2: True love. Travelling couple in the MX-3.
Bane
'93 Mazda MX-3 ZE
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mitmaks
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Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by mitmaks »

SuperK wrote::love2: True love. Travelling couple in the MX-3.
Mx-3s are better enjoyed together :love2:
Magnum s/s lines, strut bars, carbon fiber bezel, indiglow gauge, Sony Xplod, inverted c/f hood, SRD lower tie bar '93 GS SE '95 Cobra SVT #2722 '68 Charger R/T 440
http://www.cardomain.com/id/mitmaks
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ganue
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Location: Waterford, MI

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

So the night before the car was driven back to school after Christmas, I noticed there was no heat. It lost about a 1/2 gallon of coolant but only when it is really cold outside. Me thinking water pump... :shrug:

I topped it off and parked the car in the (relatively) warm garage overnight. It drove 360 miles the next day and had no issue on the drive back - coolant level was the same as when she left the house. Also no issues as long as it's warm. Yesterday it was about 25 or so and the issue recurred. No smoke. Car has a verified 83,000ish original miles on it.

It was low when I arrived in Lexington for a weekend visit. I topped it off. It was about 18F outside. Ran it and kept filling it up while the engine warmed up. Ran some errands and the car performed flawlessly.

Not having my tools and no interest in working on the car in the cold and in the parking lot, I had arranged a service time to go to Paul Miller Mazda in Lexington. Kris wrote me up and had Terry, the old timer, come out and look at the car. Terry worked on these cars when new and there was a gleam in his eye when he saw the GS SE - remembered the car.

Anyway, it was the water pump. Had them swap the timing belt and throw a new thermostat in for good measure. And replace two axle seals of which one results in about 3 oz of fluid loss per oil change. Just enough for a drip or two per night.

Looks like non-running time on a car is as bad as 200,000 miles of wear - on rubber at least. So, with a peace of mind my daughter will be back in her car tomorrow afternoon.

I am very happy with how they treated me and my daughter. They brought out Terry, he introduced himself to my daughter, we talked about how special the car is, our KLZE conversion on the last GS-SE we had, and reminisced. They took care of my baby and her baby. It was really special.

And don't tell my daughter, (she doesn't read this stuff), but they are going to do a full detail on the car for her before she picks it up. And while the work done was great, it wasn't cheap. But I have no regrets, and the detailing is "free"!! I thought that this was a classy move.

Nice place. If you are in need of dealership work, get to Paul Miller before Terry retires.

Paul MIller Mazda
1029 East New Circle Road Lexington, KY 40505
Service: (866) 572-7141
Parts: (888) 268-3275
Body Shop: (888) 822-2505
Service Hours
Mon - Fri: 7:00a - 6:00p
Sat: 8:00a - 2:00p
Sun: Closed
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
ganue
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Location: Waterford, MI

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

Current state of repaired car - detailed and all!! [damned fenders] at around 83,000 miles!!

Image
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
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Savin
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Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by Savin »

Ooooooo!!! Purrrrdy! Still a beautiful car!
'95 MX-3 RS - Project "Déjà Vu" Destined for the scrapyard.
'93 MX-3 GS - SOLD!
'93 MX-3 GS SE - Parts car!
'94 MX-3 GS - Scrapped
'94 MX-3 RS - Scrapped
'96 Sunfire SE - Scrapped
'03 Sunfire SE - Deathtrap
'95 Cavalier Base - Scrapped
'94 Thunderbird LX - Collects dust
'89 Mustang GT - SOLD!
Acheron1502
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Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by Acheron1502 »

I leave for a bit and missed all the action. One car gone and you get yet another :)

Finally getting around to fixing my car up from my last post (forever ago). Deer took out hood, front fender, bumper, and headlight. Also had my timing belt jump off on the highway after running over a fox :x

All this should be fixed this weekend.

I think we should get another shot of the 3 MXs together this summer if you guys are up for it...
92 GS 1.8 Sold
93 SE-ZE Worklog // Link to purchase thread with Mod list

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ganue
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Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

The car is home for the next 2 weeks. Let's try to have a reunion!!
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
ganue
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Posts: 314
Joined: January 27th, 2008, 11:01 pm
Location: Waterford, MI

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

Update for my own memory -

1) Mileage - 85,628 miles
2) New OEM parking brake cables - $80 a piece and well worth it. Parking brake should now work and the girl will not have to find that the car backed down an incline. No more surprises.
3) Overheated RR caliper due to frozen RR parking brake cable yielded a trashed caliper piston boot. Just bought a remanufactured caliper for $77.
4) Due to premature wear of the rear pads that I did around 8,000 miles ago and a warped rear rotor, got a replacement RR rotor and new pads under warranty. So rear brakes are back up to par.
5) Put in the other two Corksport brass bushings in the front shifter linkage. Much much better!!!
6) Minor front main seal leak. Not worried. Yet. For another day.
7) About 1/3 of the P/S and water pump drive belt sheared off and was laying in the bottom of the engine bay. Need to see why. When the dealer did the timing belt and water pump, they didn't put new belts on. Hopefully there is not a misalignment of the pulleys or any damage to a pulley that caused it. Will investigate before the care leaves this weekend. Bought new Gates belts - $44.
Eight) Oil change complete on 5/22/2014 - 85,689 miles
9) Fixed the belt beeper - put a fresh bead of solder and grease on the circuit boards shown above. No more beeping!!!

Sorry - no exciting pictures. Car is in daily use!!
Last edited by ganue on May 23rd, 2014, 10:57 pm, edited 3 times in total.
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
ganue
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Posts: 314
Joined: January 27th, 2008, 11:01 pm
Location: Waterford, MI

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

Pix - only pix...

Image


Image
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
ganue
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Posts: 314
Joined: January 27th, 2008, 11:01 pm
Location: Waterford, MI

Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by ganue »

Slight update. Car came home to stay for a little while so I could work out a few little things that are really hard to deal with from 350 miles away. Car currently has 87,600 miles on it.

This has happened since the last update:

1) Oil leak partially resolved - was the oil pressure sender (second one on 3 cars I've had to do...what a pain)
2) CV joint boot major FAIL - replaced RF CV joint with a "100% new one" - was spewing lube all over masking my ability to complete the oil leak diagnosis (a couple drips a day - just an annoyance)
3) Check engine light came on (of course as soon as daughter was leaving to go back to school - thus why the car is home now and she has my GTi - nice dad, huh?) - just an o2 sensor - easy fix.
4) 4 drips a day if the car is driven - gear lube leak from trans. Suspect shift boot seal. Not diagnosed yet. CV joint seals were replaced and its dry there.
5) So - we know the story on this car of all the rusty underbody components (even though the actual body is in great shape except the fenders and one small hole on the RR forward fender well). The smell of fuel whenever we filled up was a clue that the fuel filler neck was trashed. Turns out that the "vent stack" that runs parallel to the actual fuel fill tube had a quarter sized hole in it. With this now swapped, just about everything that needs to be replaced on the underbody - has been. Well, here's a before and after picture from tonight - thank goodness for eBay and Texas junkyards that post rust free parts:

Before:

Image

After:

Image
Last edited by ganue on August 23rd, 2014, 11:48 am, edited 2 times in total.
1993 GS SE - "slow" (Stock) - SOLD
1993 GS SE - "fast" (Curved neck KLZE, OBX headers, custom 2.5" exhaust, KL36 ECU, Exedy Probe GT clutch, KL36 LSD - the real one, Lantis Type R lefthand halfshaft - unfortunately worth mentioning)- SOLD

1993 GS SE - acquired 4/28/2013, SOLD February 28, 2015

1985 RX-7 GSL-SE - SOLD
2003 VW GTI 1.8T
2009 Mazda5 Grand Touring
Sleeper6
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Re: Another GS SE - #3 - Acquired 4/28/2013

Post by Sleeper6 »

Im amazed thats a used part :shock: , wish JY up here in NY had stuff that clean
92 GS gold (driver) worklog> http://mx-3.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=73405" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
93 GS red (wrecked)
:D I modify my ride so I can drive around the stupid people :D
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