worrying knocking noises from KLZE

[Ryan]

yeah, you have to remove the cams to remove the HLA's.

Its really not that bad, you can it all with a decent socket set (<$100) and some time, which you have since you can take the train

Lots of people on here to help if you run into trouble

But get your diagnosis down before you rip it apart

[Jforce]

time and tools is not an issue.

Only the timing belt, getting the right tightness and such. Never done a timing belt.

Actually only did, the basic stuff like brakes, shocks but no real engine stuff.

[Ryan]

hydraulic tensioner, done. There is no hitch to it, just trial and error getting the belt on right... its such a pain, you have to compensate a tooth back here, forward there, two back here...

[Jforce]

Ok were back


In december 2011 i took out the engine, replaced hla's, tensioner/timingbelt. (which was broken, the bolt hole off the tensioner literally broke off).

Thinking well that has to be the problem.

Start her up all good, drove it arround for 10 months.

And suddenly this month, same freaking knocking/clattering noise........

Immidiatly checked the tensioner but it's still in good shape.

Well this scks, back to square 1.


No clue where to look.

99% sure it aint:
HLA
Tensioner
Any idle/pulley bearing

could be:
Rod knock, but would my engine still work after 10 months if it was.
Pre-ignition, plugs are still in same shape. Though it is running somewhat rich with the KL31
Friction gear spring, Although my block code is 688025 so it should be fixed already from factory.


Spend a lot (= too much) on this car but money is running low, would hate to let her go.

[Josh]

My ZE makes the same noise. but not quite as lout as yours. I am running a KL36 ECU I am rich as well. At first I thought it was a rod knock, but not quite the right sound. Changed the oil as I had about 4500 miles on the current change and that did nothing. I think it is either a lifter or a rod knock. NO flakes so I think its a sticky lifter and I have interprep valve springs, mine is in the same spot on the motor as well. I check my oil ever couple of days for flakes and nothing, change it at 3K miles even though I am running full synthetic. It was running mobile 1 and now I have switched to crasrol. These are LOUD engines anyways, and high comp. I think more than likely it is just pre det or one of the lifters is not getting properly oiled at that specific RPM. As when you put a long extension on one of the bolts and up to your ear you cant hear it, which you would if it were a slap or knock. It runs just fine and compression is good. I am not worrying about it at all I have driven from Seattle to Portland a couple times and took it down the dyno actually have put on about 6K since I noticed the noise. I wonder if it has to do with the wrong spark plugs. IDK that is what I am changing next. It has DE plugs in it now.

[Jforce]

well for me its not a HLA for sure, swapped those out already.

It's an inconsistent noise, as far as i know rod knock makes that "tack tack tack" noise.

I cant find any reference for the Friction gear problem. Also don't know what pre-ignition sound like.

Here's a video from this year:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBb7-_Zu ... e=youtu.be

[Josh]

That sounds better than it did last year IMO. I think you are fine. Doesn't the ZE have forged pistons ? Either way being high comp like that it is bound to be a little noisy. have you listened to like a Honda B18C motor, they sound similar? You could spend forever trying to find the source. just make sure you check your oil and the change it at the proper intervals.

I drive the piss out of my car and the noise has not changed or gotten worse. I think it was always there and I only noticed it after i switched my oil from mobile one and did my suspension at the same time. I kept hearing a noise at 3K rpm while driving, couldn't figure it out, after a day realized I had dropped a socket on the engine side motor mount so at 3K it was rattling. but it sounded like a rod knock. After that I noticed the other noise same as yours. but I know its not a rod or a piston, pretty sure it is not a lifter, my other thought was a bad injector but it is kind of a deep tone for that. I think it is pre det because it has the wrong plugs, its high comp, and i changed the ecu from a DE ECU to a KL36 so it is running way rich now, even though I am getting better fuel economy.

[Jforce]

It less loud indeed.

But the fans where on to this time, so the noise wasn't recorded so well.

I'm swapping out the ECU for a chipped one.

So should be less rich, also it sounded like i had a vacuum leak.

It's also somewhat shaky on idle.


But my own guess is the friction gear.

Put a screwdriver to my ear, and its the loudest at the rear bank against the valve cover.

Pre-det is my second guess, but that will destroy your engine. So that would mean i'm not fine........

as mentioned before:

1. Pre-ignition: this is usually caused by an excess of carbon build up in the combustion chamber, which gets very hot and ignites the mixture before the plug fires. The knock comes from the force of the early ignition pushing the piston and rod back down against normal rotation (because the piston isn't in the intended ignition position yet) and it bangs against the bearing essentially destrying it in very short order. Pretty bad.

I can tear it down again ofcourse, but I wished i checked if my engine had the old design friction gear last time..............

But because it had block code 688025 i figured it should have the redesigned gear.

[WhiteFinish]

Doesn't sound that bad...

A good thing to do is to use a stethoscope. This way you can pinpoint more the exact location.
It's also possible to hear if certain bearings might be shot.

It could also be your steeringpump or something like that. When you listen its always very hard to find the exact source.

[wagZE]

Like wytbishop said assuming its not the belt tensioner /bracket. Don't be assuming try pulling the belts & their brackets & run it shortly (30 seconds max while cold) see if it knocks. I had an mx6 that had a stripped out bolt hole on the block for the top bolt on bracket for pulley tensioner on alternator belt. The bracket was knocking against the block. Had to put a larger bolt in with a crapload of loctite & it runs quiet today still. It's always a possibility good luck.

[Jforce]

@whitefinish, yeah i really need to get a stethoscope.

@wagZE,'

Yeah thats still possible, only i replaced all of that.

Last year it knocked more badly.

I replaced:

HLA
Timing belt + idlers/tensioner
Alternator
PS assembly
Clutch, Flywheel, bearings

Retorqued everything.

Everything was surprisingly clean as well:

[wagZE]

Are u running klze spark plugs? The klde plugs are longer & ze pistons collide with them sometimes, ever so slightly. Happened to a friend of mine before he had badknocking switched to the right plugs & it stopped.

[Jforce]

yup, correct plugs are in.

Where denso K20PR-U

Now NGK 2756 BKR6E-11

Weird noise, but cant do alot about it right now.

Bad weather mostly, and we don't have a garage.

Guess it will keep running fine, for a while as the knock actually is less worse than last year.

Just annoying i can't know for sure if it will do damage or not.

[ElGringo]

Did you get this figured out yet?

My MX3 stock v6 had a light knock this past january after changing the cap & rotor. I didn't have loss of power or anything, oil changes didn't help either. A couple months ago, it got really bad, the knock was the same but it would barely move under it's own power. it ended up being the timing belt skipped a tooth to start with (in Jan) and then a couple months ago it skipped I guess a few teeth. It would run, but it was ugly. she's running super quiet now that I got that fixed. Just have to get the clutch cylinders replaced and she'll be good as new.

[bbunkerc397]

Ok, had the exact same problem change your plugs and it will be fine you have wrong plugs. Also run some castrol 5w30 high mileage oil that's what I run in my car it works miracles also run a minimum of 91 octane gas to help with pre detonation knocking I run ultra94 really makes a big difference. Mine use to sound like a dump truck and gas, oil, plugs is all it was.