Mx3 with KLZE swap running rich, afterburn

[unclegreg]

One is from an MS8 (J-spec MX6) and the other is from a Eunos 800 (J-Spec Millenia)...not sure which is which off the top of my head. I believe the KL36 is the MS8 ECU.

The main difference would be the VRIS points. The MS8 had straight necks and the Eunos 800 had curved necks.

Both KL31 and 36 have the VRIS points for the Straight Neck. Eunos 800 uses a different ECU that will not fit our cars.. I think the difference between the ECUS are that one is for ATX and one for MTX, but both should do the job just fine .

Im surprised you havent pulled any codes yet? That is always a good way to start. Just jump TEN and GND and memorize the codes.

[Mnemonic]

well sure...you can do that...if you don't mind cutting corners.

Corner cutter.

I say the same thing about using the probinator chip

You could just get the correct ecu either 31/36 so that you don't need that sensor as the those ecu's don't require it and then you don't have to modify the neck at all!

But then again why even go with an oem ecu or probinator chip when for a few dollars more you can do MegaSquirt and actually see a real increase in power.

[wytbishop]

One is from an MS8 (J-spec MX6) and the other is from a Eunos 800 (J-Spec Millenia)...not sure which is which off the top of my head. I believe the KL36 is the MS8 ECU.

The main difference would be the VRIS points. The MS8 had straight necks and the Eunos 800 had curved necks.

Both KL31 and 36 have the VRIS points for the Straight Neck. Eunos 800 uses a different ECU that will not fit our cars.. I think the difference between the ECUS are that one is for ATX and one for MTX, but both should do the job just fine .

Im surprised you havent pulled any codes yet? That is always a good way to start. Just jump TEN and GND and memorize the codes.

I had a feeling I was a little off when I wrote that.

[cout]

The only chip that I'm aware of on ebay is the crap that's supposed to increase HP and fuel mileage. It's a lie. That chip is actually a resistor that alters the signal from the VAF and IAT to get the ECU to alter fuel delivery. Unless you have a link to something that I'm not aware of.

Finally got a chance to take a look at the ECU myself (the car is sitting at a friend's house out in the country) and that's exactly what's installed right now. I don't think the original owner realized what it was he was splicing in (it's a resistor sitting in a gob of glue inside a black box):



(in fact there's so much glue I can't even read the bands on the resistor)

I unfortunately didn't take good note of where he did the splice to see if I could verify he got the right wire, and I can't tell from the photo I took with my phone:



Maybe it doesn't matter though, since we're going to do it right anyway.

Two more questions:

1. What is this and is it supposed to be there?



2. How can I tell from looking at the top circuit board whether it's been chipped (guessing no based on what we already know, but I want to be sure):



(pardon my shaky hand, next time I'll remember to bring a real camera)

[wytbishop]

Item #1 there is the fuel pump relay. It's supposed to be there.

That chip on the back of the board you're holding in the shakey picture with the number on it. That's the one that gets replaced by the Probinator chip. Good news is that the 20xx number means it is chippable. 16xx numbered chips are not.

[Newfie_dan]

that resistor in a black box looks like its one of those cheap a** ebay power adder bullcrap dealios. If you have one of those installed thats the source of you running rich for sure hands down. It mods the signal from the vam/vaf and makes it run rich. Where exactly was that black box installed? If its attached to your vam/vaf wiring then remove it and reconnect and resolder/shrink tube the wiring.

[cout]

I got a chance to take a closer look at where the resistor is wired in. Turns out it's on the pink/black wire, which afaict is a water thermosensor. Hmm. That doesn't sound right.

I'm not entirely sure where it's supposed to be wired in, but the VAF makes sense, and that's the red wire. Spliced it in there and the car idles much better now (not great, but better than before).

Obviously this is just a band-aid until we can get a real fix in, but at least the car is drivable now.

[Newfie_dan]

totally remove the resistor box altogether its not stock and is making problems for you end of story, remove it reconnect the factory wiring the way it should be. I have seen these crap little boxes wired into many cars now and all they cause is trouble end of story. I had to show one poor sap who did this to his mx3 how much of a fake it was by doing a 1/4 mile run before and after it was removed and he gained a full second with it out. Like I said all they do is modify the resistance reading to the ecm which makes the car run even richer than normal and in the case of the klze or kl08 they do not need it period.

[Daninski]

well sure...you can do that...if you don't mind cutting corners.

Corner cutter.

Corner cutter? Why I otta,,,, Just drill the flat spot on the filler neck. You can also go through all this.http://www.mx6.com/forums/2g-mx6-other- ... -94-a.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Even if the ECU chip has the correct PN if the top circuit board isn't shorter than the bottom one it still isn't chipable. Check that all your vac lines are indeed correct. I saw a ZE with screwed up vac lines and it ran rich big time.

[stoker100]

wytbishop what makes you say some of the EPROMs arnt chippable?

[wytbishop]

I don't know why precisely but if you go to the probinator's cardomain page he explains that only EPROM chips from a certain series of numbers can be replaced with his chip. I'm guessing it's an architecture problem.

[stoker100]

i think thats "his" problem because his are generic, ive never found an EPROM i couldnt modify and replace. and ive come accross some weird ones before.

[cout]

We found the problem!

(Mainly the problem was finding time to find the problem)

1. All three cables on the back plugs were bad and sitting in oil:



(but no oil in the cylinder which is surprising)

Replacing the plugs and wires fixed the 3500 rpm hestitation/stutter for a while, but it came back after driving the car 30 miles or so.

2. The TPS sensor wasn't reading right. We replaced the sensor and rotated it so the car would run leaner. This helped but didn't fix the problem.

3. The base timing was WAY off, like 25 degrees or so. We retarted the timing as much as we could; now we're at maybe 12 degrees. now the 3500 rpm hestiation/stutter is completely gone and the car is no longer backfiring. I feel so silly for not trying this sooner, but no big deal since there have been so many other things to fix.

4. We rotated the TPS sensor back to where it started. If we have time (two weeks until the race!) we'll get the multimeter out again and make sure it's set properly.

I ordered the probinator chip and the one from ebay but haven't installed them yet. The car is running lean enough without it and the chip just adds to the cost of the car. But maybe we'll try it after the race (or since we do now have a spare ECU, chip that one and see what happens).

[wytbishop]

I have a set of new VC gaskets you can have for $20+shipping. Sounds like you could use them.