Codes and other problems

vozaday2000 · Post by **vozaday2000** » October 18th, 2005, 11:08 pm

Ok, i know you are getting tired of me with all these codes but hear me out.

i had switched the vaf's with the je50 and had noticed a performance difference and had no more codes for about a week. i went over to Ricks and we tried to figure out what was wrong with my idle. on my way over to Ricks my check engine light came on, it was weird, my car almost stalled from the idle and my check engine light came one. then when it almost stalled the light turned off, then when it almost stalled again it came on once again but stayed on for the remainder of the trip. well we pulled the codes and got 16, 11 or 20, 4 and 15. i think that was all of them. then we switched ecu's (still k8) and right off the bat we got code 69. then we took it for a rip and checked the codes again. we got 69, 15.

ok so some background. I have the k8 ecu, both ecu's we used were k8's. have the je50 vaf. both o2 sensor's are new. couldn't find any vacuum leaks, but is suspected, sprayed the engine but no idle change but we think it may be the thermospacers leaking.

oh and i noticed that my car only started to idle bad after the fan kicks in for the first time. when the engine is cold it idles' perfectly then when the fan kicks in it raises the idle to 1200rpms, then when the fan shuts off the car almost stalls, then goes to 2000rpms, then almost stalls, so on.... eventually it goes back to normal but then starts over again when the fan turns back on.

we are going to take a more indepth look into it possibly this weekend but any ideas would be appreciated.

Thank you for your time and patience with me,

Ryan

PATDIESEL · Post by **PATDIESEL** » October 19th, 2005, 1:22 am

Actually this sounds like it may be an easy fix. Check your alternator. It has a built in voltage stabalizer and it is supposed to help with sudden draws of power from things like COOLING FANS. The easiest way to check it is to take your alt to AutoZone and they will check it for free. Or you can buy an aftermarket one and put it just next to the positive battery terminal inline with the battery cable. There could also be something wrong with your fan. It may have a bad bearing and is drawing too much current for the alt to handle and the engine is raising revs to try and compensate. New fans are easy to come by in a junkyard. Auto, manual, ac, no ac, are all the same. I don't know if 4 bangers and 6s are the same though.
Try those two things to get rid of the fan problem.

Also I'm too lazy to pul out the Mazda shop manual so what do all thos codes mean?

vozaday2000 · Post by **vozaday2000** » October 19th, 2005, 9:06 am

code 69, 11, 20, 4(code 4 does but i got 4 flashes and the online manual says code 4 is supposed to have 5 flashes so technically it probably should be code 3) do not exist. but we think code 69 may have to do with the older ecu, the second ecu we tried was a 92 or 93 (can't remember which). code 16 is egr and code 15 is firewall o2 sensor. like i said the o2 sensor is brand new.

the rad shackes a bit when the fan is on so i will look into getting a second one.

vozaday2000 · Post by **vozaday2000** » October 19th, 2005, 10:32 pm

ok, today i unplugged my fan fuse and drove my car around. it basically acted the same. it was a little better but not much. the idle was eratic and when i was driving then came to a complete stop every once in a while it would almost die. oh and the tps is set to proper resistances. i have the klze 110a alternator with me but i don't think i have the 3 connecter piece to hook up the alternator but i will look for it. then i can see if the alternator is a bit of the problem.

vozaday2000 · Post by **vozaday2000** » October 21st, 2005, 6:54 pm

ok i tried to test my car to see if the voltage drops when the fan comes on at idle. well i had some complications. i let my car idle for a while, a long while, and got impatient so i hit the throttle cable to bring the rpms up a bit. my car reved up, then it went to 1200 rpms, then 800 rpms, then it dropped right down to zero rpms, then it bounced up to 1500 rpms, then it stalled. so i turned over the ignition and it went right up to 1200rpms, then it repeated the process over again. so i start it again, this time i held my foot on the throttle for a bit but once i let my foot off the process started again and stalled. and my fan still hadn't come on.

oh and i had a voltmetre hooked up and when it almost stalled the volts dropped to 13 volts, but i figure that is normal since the revs went so low.

EDIT
oh and the alternator is new, it has approx 10,000 km's

vozaday2000 · Post by **vozaday2000** » October 26th, 2005, 12:32 am

a little update. when i had my intake manifold off i noticed a pool of antifreeze sitting on the engine. my guess is that it is leaking from the tube that runs from the passenger side to the thermostat. so i think my problem was bubbles in the IAC. so i unplugged the IAC, the problem was almost solved. it idled fine but everyonce and a while it would fluctuate between 700 and 600 rpms. and once it went up to 1500 and fluctuated between 1500 and 1000. but it only happened once. any more ideas on this one. unpluggin the IAC should remove the fluctuation due to bubbles in the coolant, but it hasn't removed all fluctuation. any ideas?

oh and i sealed basically everything, and replaced all the vacuum lines, sealed them to the valves, etc. tested all the vacuum lines i didn't replace, tested the vacuum chambers. so i don't think there is a vacuum leak. but i still have the codes; 15, 16, it was either 24 or 20 and 4 (but i don't understand why 24 when i shut off the engine and it didn't die), and now 34 but understandable since the iac is disconnected.

ok now for the engine light. there is a noticeable loss in hp when the light comes on. now coming back to calgary from canmore my check engine light came on. no biggy since it has been doin this for a while, then after about a half an hour of driving the light all of a suddenly shuts off. now i don't know if my speed was changed to cause the light to come off or what happened but it did. and i noticed more power in the high end (felt like a difference between 5 to 10 whp possibly more) this was not caused by bogging just to get that question out of the way. then another half an hour down the road the light came back on, and hp loss again.

so any ideas on my problems? oh and yes the iac thing, and lack of attention to the leak is only a quick fix, i have to wait until i go back home and take more parts off the k8.

vozaday2000 · Post by **vozaday2000** » October 28th, 2005, 9:00 am

PATDIESEL · Post by **PATDIESEL** » October 28th, 2005, 10:27 am

Lets try and get one problem fixed at a time and then work tword a final, well running car.
#1. the fan shakes when it turns on. This is interesting, but I guess not too big of a problem. It will only shake for a few reasons. A. you didn't put the rubber bushings in hte bottom when you dropped it in B. the fan's bearing is bad and it is therefor not balanced anymore C. the motor on the fan is messed up somehow. Problem A. is easy, double check that you did put the rubber bushings back in (even if you've never take nthe radiator out they may hav rotted out and need to be replaced) section B. and C. are also easy in that you just need to replace the fan. They are easy to come by in junk yards so get a few and that way you have a better chance at getting a good one.

#2. funny idle, It could be bubbles in the IAC and I have hear that disconnecting the IAC will help in some cases. However it is not the right answer since it is needed for the ECU to think everything is ok. So fix the leak and then refill the radiator fluid, leave the cap open and let the bubbles work themselves out, then check for the AIC code again. I dount this fixes your idle issue completely though. Maybe pick up a few IAC valves while at the junkyard for the fan just to make sure yours is operating properly.

#3. alternator is fine if it only dropped to 13 volts, but was there a spike in volts when the fan turned on or was there a drop in volts when the fan turned on. A large (4-5 volts) drop or spike will denote a poorly operating voltage regulator. However, just to clarify you actually need to be reading for amps on a volt meter, but most volt meters won't read for amps so we will use voltage instead. Not actually the most acurate way to tell, but it should help get an idea.
Check for the above #1 and #2 problems and lets see how the car acts then. If it is still running rough then you might need to go back and check for vacuum leaks again. I know you said you "sealed" everything, but if you didn't use the factory torque specs it would be easy to still have a leak. The issue is that when tightening the bolts on most of the cars parts you have to remember that when the motor is brand new all the parts will mate up perfectly at their seams. Heat over time will warp the parts and thus the seams will not line up perfectly anymore. The bolts tightening order and torque spec will ensure that the parts are pulled together properly and the seams pulled closed.
So when tightening all the bolts did you use a torque wrench and Mazda's tightening order? If not then before you go checking all the parts for leaks you really need to undo all the bolts that you took off of the valve covers and intake (if you took them off) and torque them properly.